CAW defiant in face of Chrysler's demands

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CAW defiant in face of Chrysler's demands

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CTV News Video

CTV News: Graham Richardson on carmakers coping

Power Play: CAW President Ken Lewenza reacts to Chrysler's demands

Power Play: Gary Hufbauer and Bernard Wolf, industry experts, on giving Chrysler a lifeline

CTV Toronto: Michael Bryant on the Chrysler threat

CTV Newsnet: BNN's Michael Kane on whether Chrysler's demands are realistic

Canada AM: Industry Minister Tony Clement says the auto industry is in an 'existential crisis'

Canada AM: Ken Lewenza, president of the CAW president, says Chrysler's 'this way or no way' demands leave little room for alternatives

Canada AM: David Paterson, vice-president with GM Canada, says the deal with workers is an extremely positive step, and that the concessions are a shared sacrifice

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CTV.ca News Staff

Date: Thu. Mar. 12 2009 8:44 PM ET

The president of the Canadian Auto Workers says he won't agree to slash labour costs by 25 per cent, despite a threat from Chrysler that anything less will force the automaker to pull out of Canada.

CAW President Ken Lewenza said Chrysler's demands would give it an unfair advantage over its competitors and fly in the face of a new agreement between the union and General Motors.

"We're not about to break the pattern established at General Motors," Lewenza told CTV's Power Play on Thursday.

The comments come after Chrysler president Tom LaSorda said Wednesday that the company needs US$2.3 billion from Ottawa, along with major sacrifices from the CAW and a big break on $500 million in back taxes in order to stay in Canada.

LaSorda added that Chrysler would be willing to pull out of Canada, where it employs about 10,000 people, if it makes financial sense to do so.

But on Thursday, Lewenza said backing down to LaSorda's demands isn't a possibility.

"Under no conditions will we break the pattern with General Motors. The idea of patterned bargaining is to make sure that the automobile companies aren't at an advantage or a disadvantage," he said.

On Wednesday, General Motors reached an agreement with CAW that included major concessions by the union, in hopes of getting federal bailout funds.

CAW members voted 87 per cent in favour of the cost-cutting contract that includes a wage freeze to September 2012, the elimination of an annual bonus and a reduction in paid time off, among other concessions.

"We cannot disadvantage General Motors nor will we disadvantage our CAW members at Chrysler corporation," said Lewenza.

The CAW has generally used its first deal with a Big Three automaker to set a pattern for agreements with the other two.

LaSorda said his company's labour costs are $70 an hour in wages and benefits for both current workers and retirees. He says it needs to be cut by $20 per hour to be competitive.

But Lewenza downplayed those comments and said that it makes economic sense to build cars in Canada.

"Canada is by far the most successful and competitive environment to manufacture vehicles," he said.

"It certainly sounds like an ultimatum to us: either provide us the loans or we're not going to be here, give us a tax exemption or we're not going to be here," he said.

Political response

Later on Thursday, Federal Industry Minister Tony Clement said that Ottawa won't hand Chrysler a blank cheque, despite the threat of the company pulling out.

Clement added that Ottawa will relentlessly review the automakers' bailout proposals to ensure that Canadian taxpayers aren't left on the hook.

Still, Clement added that Canada must act to protect the auto sector, which employs about 10 per cent of the country's workforce either directly or indirectly.

Meanwhile, Ontario's economic development minister tried to pass off Chrysler's threat to leave Canada if its demands aren't met as simply a worst-case scenario being presented as part of a bargaining process.

"I know Tom LaSorda, he's a great Canadian and he's not somebody who wants to be known as they guy who shut down Chrysler," Michael Bryant told reporters in Toronto on Thursday.

"It was a ham-fisted way of expressing the reality that, in the absence of an agreement, Chrysler's going to face critical challenges."

With files from The Canadian Press

Comments are now closed for this story

Jon In London ON
said

Read between the lines. Chrysler LLC is bailing on Canada. They just want the money and the tax forgiveness before they go.

Tom
said

Go ahead let Chrysler leave Canada but if they do let them know that not another Chrysler vehicle will be sold on Canadian soil ever again.

Lynn in Hamilton, ON
said

If they can prove that it really does cost them $20.00 more an hour than the other auto company's, I feel that the employees should be willing to take the cut or lose their jobs. If Chrysler was to pull out of Canada all together, those that currently work there would be hard pressed to find a job that pays so well. If you currently make $30.00 an hour, $25.00 an hour with less benefits and less put into your pension should be fine. My employer doesn't even offer benefits or pension. I want a pension I put my own money into it!! If I had the choice of taking a pay cut or being out of a job, I would take the pay cut.... time to suck it up buttercup!!!

John E
said

Hey! The auto industry is in the same crisis as the Conservative Party and Mr. Harper........ an "existential crisis". Tony must have read a dictionary this week.
As for Chrysler. Let it go.

David From Windsor
said

A blow like this would cripple Windsor for longer than I would even like to imagine. Many people will comment and say that it's just a bunch of overpaid union workers that have it too good. It is that narrow minded thinking that is hurting everyone involved and even the people that are indirectly involved. The ripple effect would go further than anyone really understands or wants to even imagine. I would never wish for so many families to lose their jobs (I think the individuals that do want Chrysler to fall are very sick for wanting that) and I hope that Mr. Clement & Mr. Harper know that they should choose their words wisely over the next few days. It could make the difference of how Ontario votes next time around.

Henry Wysmulek
said

The real story here is these losers at chrysler management have already decided to move to slave labour in other parts of the world and are just using this as an excuse to justify and actually leave North America!

Screw these pricks and let them leave! They will leave anyway and laugh in our faces as they get their big bonus checks from the stupid Taxpayers of Canada!

Ford pulled itself out of the same situation! So what is wrong with the management losers at Chrysler and g.m.?

Randy, Ontario
said

So the taxpayers are on the hook to save the CAW workers who have held the auto companies hostage with the threat of strike...

CAW should be forced to take a reduction before any taxpayer money is given.

Larry I Ontario
said

This government thinks by throwing money at an extremly badly managed company it will save jobs. don't wast my tax money on the obvious failure of these companies. Help the little guy who is drowning! Time to elect a new government who will not lie to us like Harper has and still is.

Seppo in Woodstock ON
said

The math doesn't work unless Canada is the new Mexico according to Chrysler:
- the Canadian dollar is 20% lower than the USD
- Chrysler wants a 25% drop in wages for the workers
This adds up to 45% cheaper labour costs in Canada. Add on the OHIP benefits that Chrysler doesn't pay for plus the 2.3 USD "loan" they want... si, si senor!
All I can say is bye, bye Chrysler!

Ian in Ottawa
said

I think the answer is simple. Give them a loan. Make it contingent on restructuring and concessions from labour unions. That will make them a more viable company. However, they NEED to lure customers back to their lacklustre brand. You do that by building better cars, and more importantly, more appealing. Yes, everybody wants a good car, but people also want a nice looking one when they spend over $20,000 on it. Why don't they "steal" some talent from Toyota, Nissan or Honda? Offer a nice incentive to come over and breathe life into the North American auto sector.

Brad
said

And Ken L. calls this BLACKMAIL????? The adversarial relationship between management and the union is alive but not well! Threaten to close up shop? Sound familiar Ken? We will strike then if you don't give us what we want has always been your answer. Chrysler has just served up a big slice of humble pie and the longer you wait to take a bite the worse it's going to taste! So put on you napkin and grab a fork and take a BIG bite so both sided can get on with the important task at hand and actually save a few jobs this time!

Phil
said

Is it really $70/hr? If so, then I have no pity and I hope they've been saving it for the long period of unemployment that the unions have brought on themselves...

Too bad for all the parts suppliers who probably work twice as hard for half as much.

catsrulz muskoka
said

So all these auto workers have been posting here that they make no where near $70/$75/hr. SO I guess that with LaSorda who happens to be the president of chysler is BSing us with what the company pays to their workers. Or that the workers on here dont want to admit to everyone that they do make $70hr so that they wont lose that cottage in muskoka and their speed boat at dockside. They want rest of canada to feel sorry for them. Well if chrysler want to pull out of Canada I say let them go and lets see how many cars/trucks/vans that they will sell in Canada then. I know sales will go way way down. I say no more money to them its called blackmail. Bye bye chrsler or should that be CRYsler.

Carol
said

I don't want to give these guys a dime of my tax money. There going to go bankrupt and take it all with them. Goodbye to Chrysler. Another company will come in and take over their plants. There is still lots of companies out there that have the ability to make money. We don't have to make cars in these plants.

the real CC
said

I am really not sure when the auto makers became the ones that can place "demands" on the government and Canadian taxpayers. However, if blackmail and threats are their way of "asking" for help...I say let them leave. It makes me and so many others, I'm sure, sick to watch our tax dollars get flushed down the toilet. I've had it with GM and Chrysler. Let them leave. I know there will be job losses, but other new, inovative companys will take their place. Maybe even companys that can build a product that is affordable and built to actually last longer than the warranty. I am one voter that will cheer if these companys claim bankruptcy in Canada. Sorry...the gravey train has come to a stop...time to find other work. I had to retrain myself 4 times in my life. No help from government, no extra EI, no retraining...just me and my own determination. Honest...you can do it too.

Joe
said

Well as you can see if you read between the lines, they have already decided to pull out of Canada and move back to the states. The big whigs are now trying to bully the Gov to either pay what we want or else. Hopefully our Gov does'nt cave in to this tactic and stay with a sound plan or no money.

Dave Ontario East
said

Hope the Government is reading these forums, as many times the voice of the citizens are more realistics as to the real situation.Nothing stays the sames.To keep up with the market requires change, what was good 10 yrs ago will not apply today.Banks provide business loans to those businesses that show potential. Chrysler does not show potential and the money (taxpayers) will be never repaid).Gvt needs to look at the bigger perspective. Cutting salaries and benefits to Chrysler will lower productivity substantially, as employees will do less for less. Chrysler service is not their strong selling point,and their overpriced low quality cars just dont cut it in todays market.Many many more car mfgrs than ever besides Chrysler.Profits going to CEOs and execs coffers when it shud be in R&D and back to workers.Worst decision Gvt can make is support a losing venture.

Dayton
said

When a CAW worker has a better wage and benefit package than most of our M.P.'s something is wrong here. Cut them loose!!!

A Budd
said

I see that they have to cut production costs but where are the cuts for management? The little guy is being made to take pay cut or job loss. Why not cut management wages by 25%to 50%?

KJ in Kingston Ontario
said

So the CAW-GM deal eliminates one week of time off and DIVERTS a $1,700 annual bonus from workers' pockets to retiree health care. Now the $1,700 is just moving money around for them -- it is NOT LOSING $$ or REDUCING costs.... One week off is about $500 for most workers making about 1.5 times minimum wage -- and now Canadian tax payers are expected to borrow and GIVE AWAY to the Auto Companies $7 Billion or at least $1,000 per average tax payer plus interest....

We are then basically expected to give up about twice as much (or 4 times as much per two income family) as the individual CAW members are giving up -- so they can keep their high paying jobs!!!!!

Like I have said before THIS IS TOTAL MADNESS!!!!!!

Kyle - Vaudreuil, Quebec
said

So Ford says to the Government "We do not want you money. We make good cars that people will buy." GM says "We need the government's help and we will work with all involved to save our company and as many of the jobs as we can." Now Chrysler says "F-you give me money or we are out of here!". Although it is not a good option I would love to hear Tony Clement say to Tom Lasorda "Don't let the door hit you on the way out!" Chrysler seems to be the only car company that does not understand that any money from the government is other peoples money! I don't like bailing out businesses who have poor plans but I accept it as it will help keep my neighbours employed. It irks me to hear a corporate President talk like his company deserves my money.

Tom in London
said

Chrysler is oened by a private investment group, you know one of the ones that caused this vrisis in the first place. They are going to bail eventually anyway if they can't sell it. Right now it cannot be sold for
a) sales suck
b) they owe way too much in back taxes to Canada
If they don't pay their taxes how in the world will thye ever pay a "loan" back.
AMnswer, they wqon't. Let them go it will be cheaper in the long run for everyone.

stu
said

Don't forget that Chrysler is owned by a multibillion dollar international investment firm called "Cerberus". The mother company has never once offered to pony up the money to help its investment (Chrysler) survive.

If the owner's see it as a bad investment, why is the government even considering it?

By the way "Cerberus" in Greek mythology was the giant dog that guarded the gates of hell....so no one could escape.

db
said

bye bye chrysler. Good riddance!

Nate
said

catsrulz muskoka
So all these auto workers have been posting here that they make no where near $70/$75/hr.

The $70/h includes wages, benefits, pension contributions, retiree benefits etc. That is a number thrown out there by someone making millions of dollars a year. Autoworkers make nowhere near that in hourly wages. When compared to the $50/hour that Toyota, Honda and Nissan make, you have to factor in that those companies have only been producing vehicles on North American soil for 25 years. Their number of retirees are nowhere nears as much as the Detroit 3. Take those numbers with a grain of salt. Remember, Mr LaSorda probably makes in excess of $1 million/ year. Where's his cuts?

HIT THE ROAD !
said

Just 1 question :

WHY SHOULD WE !

We all know for years you had the knowledge to build a car with exceptional milage , of course that wouldn't be in the best interest of the comsumer .
You always put your self first and the consumer last.

It's time to say GOOD BY .

He who builds the best sells the most.

Cambob
said

The Canadian Government has already given billions of our money to the auto industry.

Seriously people, if they give more welfare to these billion dollar AMERICAN companies, we must reconsider paying tax to the federal and provinical governments.

Opimist
said

The North American automotive business model cannot survive this turmoil in it's present form. Taxpayers money should go to those businesses that demonstrate they are viable for both today and for the foreseeable future. I feel for those folks whose jobs are at risk in this sector, but we have to turn the corner and invest in growth, not dinosaurs. We also need to understand and learn from these events, if we are to grow and prosper in the long run.

Dave
said

First the car companies were begging for money they have no ability or intention to pay back. Now, the extortion starts. Meanwhile, if the response online is anything to go by, Canadians are aghast that governments would even think of giving this bunch of short-sighted clowns a nickel, never mind the billions they now DEMAND. GM. Chrysler, ask not what our country can do for you. We see no reason to throw another penny your way. It matters not whether the unions or management caused this crisis, or both. It only matters that it is OVER, and it's time for us all to face the music. No doubt the bankruptcy of these companies will hit us hard, but it's coming anyway, and a paltry few billion more cannot reverse that fact.

Grant Guelph
said

Think this one through. It is the same old way of doing business. Let Chrysler go. The reality is that the whole Auto industry is restructuring and there will be a lot of losers as in bankrupt companies and dissappearing divisions. Any bailout is gambling. I would rather see 2.3 billion invested in a new economy (energy tech) than help sell 2008 models with no guarantee of jobs. Blackmail only works if you are acting from a position of strength Mr. LaSorda

Dave Montreal
said

Gvt doing the right thing.If Chrysler was given the loan,would that help to bring them back into the marketplace? How can Chrysler earn back the consumer trust and credibility? Their cars are way overpriced.Their quality deteriored significantly,their after the sale support is horrendous, their reputation declined due to their attitude v/s GM and Ford. Ford is in the same boat but they dont cry, beg for money, or threaten. I bought an Eagle Talon a few yrs ago,Chrysler could never find or fix a computer prblm from day 1 and never replaced the computer in car.You need to do simple arithmetic...4 million cars bought annualy, what % are Chrysler products? To get marketshare you need to have all of the above factors, good value,good service,good management,reliability..Chrysler fails miserably in all these depts..and Gvt will feed them $$$ ???? Any business person or economist can clearly see this is a very high risk investment.Chrysler has to earn customers trust, not an overnight thing. File for bancrupcy or move and let a "Honda" type company begin over with the needs of todays market. Chrysler we are not in the 70's today!

Mel from Calgary
said

It looks like trading away the benefits of the "Auto Pact" to sign the Free Trade Agreement was very short sighted.

Sherry
said

I say good-bye Chrysler and since you are not paying your taxes we the government (people) will take your plants and land and re-sell it for some nice home development.

David From Windsor Ontario
said

The $70/hr is used to reflect wage costs, health care benifits, pension and all other aspects pertaining to the employee. Just like any other job, your rate of pay is not what it costs your employer to employ you. Are so many people out there that ignorant to think that a GM worker makes $70/hr? Standard wages are approx $35/hr. For those that think they make too much, you probably do too!

Ronald in Toronto
said

If 5000 workers were each given $200,000.00, that would add up to 1 billion dollars - less than half of what Chrysler is demanding.

I'm not suggesting that as a strategy, but it begs the question: What am I missing?

And yes, I do appreciate the "ripple effect".

Brian in Sarnia
said

Well, Chrysler shouldn't be rewarded for producing garbage in our own backyard. Prove that you plan on making good cars here, and plan on inmproving the quality of the workmanship. Yes, workmanship. You have an industry full of uneducated labour with poor work ethic. Check out the Toyota plant, where they get paid less and make far better cars... largely based on design and quality of staff.

TVic
said

I hope this is nothng more than the company giving the union the message that they had better come to the bargaining table with some serious concessions.
Otherwise - blow 'em a kiss goodbye, Tony. I don't want my tax dollars being held to ransom!!

D.K.
said

As Lasorda says they have an empty plant in St.Louis that was building minivans and they can go back. I think he is ready to pull out of Canada and this is his way of getting more of the U.S. bailout.

We Canadians are smug enough to threaten to not buy Chrysler products. Remember we are probably less than 5% of their world market so this is not much of a threat since the Americans will buy more of their products to show their loyalty to a company that brought jobs back to them.

Huge wage cuts, moving all operations back to U.S. sounds like a Chapter 11 bankruptcy plan.

Car - Winnipeg
said

The writing is on the wall. Let them go. Chrysler is all ready cutting one shift; that is just the start. Save the money and retrain these workers to do something else where Ontario (not Canada) relies on a failing Auto Industry as its only source of employment!

Nick in Gatineau
said

All this shows is how dis-associated unions are from the reality of business.

Businesses exist to make money.

The more Unions wrangle them for their 'fair share' as they put it, the less profit a business makes. After 15 or 16 bargaining agreements, what do you think the profit margin is going to be ?

Only options are to hike up the price of the product - which they did. What cost $ 10,000 in 1980, now costs $ 25,000 if not more. The quality of steel used has dwindled. The safety of the vehicles is restricted to the cabin only. Just take a look at bumpers on the new cars. The cars asre made to be write-offs if you are in an accident - justifying exhorbitant Insurance costs.

So the manufacturers have lowered the material costs while the salaries increased by how much ? 400 % ? 500 % ? 600 % more than what they were 30 years ago ?

Let Chrysler go and take the option of the lien. If people in windsor are scared, tell them to talk to all those mining communities that are ghost towns now, or the Oil communities that are fast becoming ghost towns. Tell them to talk to the those in the Pulp / Paper / Lumber industry. Or the Fisheries industry. Or the Hightech sector. The list goes on and on.

The only people I feel bad for are the retirees.

Unions do not care about non-unionized workers in Canada and don't realize that their actions is what is causing many canadians to end up in poverty.

Just wait until Government unions reach the same point of no return !!! The famous point where Uinions will be forced to cut their numbers (and thus service) in order to obtain what they wish for.

Roger T
said

The Gov't is only putting themselves in deeper water by giving out bailout to GM which allows other big companies to blackmail them into giving others also. There should be NO BAILOUT from tax payers money for any company. It is the will of the union employees to save their own job by reducing wage and hours, at least they'll be getting a smaller cheque but there is still cash flow.

NO BAILOUT FROM TAX PAYERS MONEY!

John -- Chatham
said

I work at Chrysler in Windsor and told my union rep 8 months ago that this would happen(they were fighting about a messly 30 minute start time on Sunday). He basically said I was crazy, they couldn't pull out and there would be a huge outcry if they did. The average worker is not the problem, it is the hard headed union reps, and heads who still have not taken off the blinders and looked around to see what is going on in the world. I have suggested to them (union)that I was willing to take a $5 an hour pay cut and start contributing to my pension (5-7% per week), the response was "you'll never make committe-man talking like that". More people than not would agree to this, Lewenza's trained seals from the 60's and 70's are now outnumbered, and the only people who would benefit from a closure would be the union reps who all have at least 30 or more years senority. The only reason the union doesn't want wage cuts is because union dues would go down. Well tough, sell the union cottage in Port Elgin it must be worth millions, the only people that benefit from this are the brainwahed union jerk-offs.

André in Ontario
said

What doesn't seem to have made it into this news article is that Chrysler is very upset with GM accepting what the CAW has done for them in there negotiations. Is that they didn't take a wage cut what so ever. And rightfully so Chrysler should be upset & so should Ford. The agreement between the CAW & GM is a joke & the CAW wants to use that agreement for its pattern for the other 2 companies. As far as I'm concern the government shouldn't give GM a dime till the CAW takes a minimum of a 25% wage cut. GM management agreed to this because they'll need to take a large cut also & don't want to. GM execs & the CAW are cut from the same cloth. Greed & incompetence. Now CTV once in awhile would be nice if they put the whole story out there & not just bits for sensationalism.

CYL
said

Please leave Canada and take Chrysler with you. We should not accept BLACKMAIL. I am a tax payer and do not appreciate the way this is handled especially by those who are earning millions and want more bailout money.

Craig from NS
said

$70/hr in labor costs and benefits!!?? I have a decent salary and pretty good benefits and I know it's only costing the company I work for $35/hr in costs. The Automakers management needs to be efficient and make better decisions. Unionists better take a a good look at what's coming if they don't make concessions. Three-quarters of something is better than nothing at all. The three-quarters is still pretty damn good.

Mike F from Whitby
said

Many people are saying let them leave.. screw them.
Auto workers do make a lot more money than most canadians with fewer skills and education.
But they also spend it. Keeping a lot of other canadians employed directly and indirectly.
Yes they make $35-40/hr with great benefits which can add up to 70/hr if the whole family uses the benefits.

I have experienced first hand what happens when we don't support our own. Our furniture plant was shut down because we couldn't compete with unfair competition in China. almost 500 people out of work.

I have been buying domestically made chrysler cars for the last 15 years and have never had any problems.I know there are superior brands, but I'm not perfect myself and dont expect it from others.

Rick in Clayton
said

$70 bucks an hour, holy ....I.d do these guys the job for less than half of that, for at that salary I could probably retire working for them in ten years. Thes people became hungry, took everything they,re bellys can take and left no room for desert. I sure as hell hope this governement don,t go giving you a piece of MY PIE.

DP
said

I will pull my business out of Canada unless I receive a billion and a waiver on any tax payments for life. Anybody wants to join me? There's MILLIONS of us vs just ONE Crysler.

M.Hall - Ontario
said

Chrysler is owned by private investors. I believe one of the investors is from the middle east. If they are not willing to put more in they certainly have more moxy about business then any government..........with one exception they installed a CEO that ran Home Depot down and he left there with a $211 million severance. He doesn't know anything about manufacturing and reorganization. Let him learn Spanish!

reidjr
said

The auto workers need to take a pay cut if they want help.Lets say $40.00 per hour that is a very good wage.

James
said

Good riddance to Chrysler if this is the attitude they have. Now is not the time for Chrysler to be playing hard ball with the Canadian taxpayer. Personally, I think this is the last desparate act of a failed company and Canadians need to face that fact and move on. G.M and Ford and the Asian carmakers could fill the void left by Chrysler. Good riddance!!

Steve T
said

The CAW / UAW true colours were shown a few months ago, when they were asked by the U.S. Congress to match their wages to the wages of the U.S. employees of Toyota and Honda. The UAW refused.
Is it any wonder the Big 3 aren't competitive, with this type of goofy attitude by their employees?

Al
said

Every auto manufacturer is hurting, some much more than others. Where has the money gone from years of success with the minivans and the 300 triplets?

The D3 need to follow the Japanese model, from the penthouse to the lineworker. Why is a Canadian exec of a failing company worth 20 times what his Japanese counterpart is worth?Where is the personal responsibility of the people, like LaSorda, making these huge paycheques?
If Toyota can make money in Canada with similar pay schedules, the difference must be on the management side of the equation.
I do not think the Canadian operations of either GM or Chrysler have led to their current problems, but of course they don't have to open their books to disprove my theory.

pete
said

I agree with Tom. If Chrysler is going to threathen to leave Canada, then leave.

Do they think losing access to 35 million consumers (Canada WILL come out of this downturn first.. and strongest) is going to help their bottom line?

Brian in Toronto
said

A private equity hedge fund bought Chrysler, wanted to chop it up and sell for a profit, now they are losing billions and want a bailout for a bad investment. Auto workers are over paid, mostly high school educated, with 6-8 weeks off a year paid, they retire early with full pay and benefits which they don't contribute too off their pay check. They should get a job in the real world with no benefits, investing after tax dollars in their own RRSP, a job where if the company doesn't make money it goes bankrupt! I drive a Chrysler and a Jeep and love them, but don't support a bailout to a private equity hedge fund.

Chris, Irishtown NL
said

Let 'em go - I'm sure there is at least one enterprising business person in Ontario that could take a $3 Billion loan and create 5,000 jobs. In the short term, Ontario will survive - the East Coast, which has a much smaller labour force, managed to get through the +25,000 jobs lost from the colapse of the cod fishery.

Keith R. , Enfield,N.S.
said

My biggest issue is with Chrysler saying,in effect,"this is it,take it or leave it". I would be inclined to say"bye." But,the result of a pull-out would be devastating to thousands of Canadian workers.
That being said, ALL stake-holders have to discuss all options and reach a solution , fair to everyone.
Not the least of which is the Canadian taxpayer.
For all that, I am not entirely confident Chrysler will survive even will a massive loan or severe worker concessions.

Melissa
said

1. Don't make 10 models of the EXACT same car with a moderate different feature...the consumer is smart to know they're identical.

2. Quit paying the top guys millions a year...hard to feel sorry for multi-billionaires, when I struggle to buy groceries.

3. Suck it up and fix it yourselves. If you can't fend for yourselves you shouldn't be in todays world.

MCinNB
said

It was written by someone who can't read "So all these auto workers have been posting here that they make no where near $70/$75/hr. SO I guess that with LaSorda who happens to be the president of chysler is BSing us with what the company pays to their workers."

If you read the article you would see that in that number is also the cost of benefits and additionally, the cost of retirees. So no, they aren't making $70/hr according to him, but every hour worked, when you add wage, benefits and the retiree costs, costs them $70, that's not the same thing.

The fact is, the cost to carry anyone who works is far greater than their salary. It's salary, payrolll taxes, office space, electricity, the computer you may work on, phones, overhead (payroll, HR, etc) and so on and so on.

So before you say Haha gotcha! try reading a bit more and writing a bit less. As the timeless expression goes, it's best to stay quiet and though a fool than to speak up and remove all doubt.

OMG $70/hr
said

$70/hr - that's $145,600/year!!! And people are complaining how much executives are making. We pay MP's $155,000/yr. and there (supposed to be) running the country, not putting a screw in a car door. Am I the only one that sees something wrong with this picture.

Jake in Oshawa
said

Let me get this straight. A CAW member gets a high hourly wage, up to 10 weeks paid holidays, life time medical(also their health benefits protect them while in Florida or whatever foreign country)/dental/prescription/chiropractic care/, contributes nothing to his or her pension, gets a new vehicle at a special "reduced employee" price, pays no Ontario Health premium, reduced or no cost legal and child care and a $1700 bonus. I'm sorry, I know some of their jobs are extremely repetitive and onerous but they are quite well compensated and need to consider what they are trying to have us believe. They didn't really sacrifice too much in this last renegotiation of their contract! It's sad when anyone looses a job but must all of the country pay for the auto manufacturers' lack of foresight?

Jim in Edmonton
said

Yes, let's keep on building over priced cars the folks these days can't afford so CAW people can make $70.00 an hour ... right! Ex. many people are now buying HDTV's because the price is coming down but the price of cars is going up ... let them restructure and build something we want and can afford. If not don't put our money into a loosing cause - doesn't anyone remember that this didn't work in England?

Rick from SK
said

$70 per hour in wages and benefits?!?!?! WTF? And they are asking my kid who works at a Tim Hortons to work longer hours (pay taxes) to support these guys jobs? I dont' think so. Suck it up and take the pay cut guys or go home.

Gary
said

Chrysler was number one in canada for Feb. and now they think they have control over the people wow. Its simple don't buy there product if that is the way they look at the people that feed them. Let them build all there product in the States and slap an omport fee on all there imported product,Its time the Government took control as our representative in this matter. Put them on there knees they are a private company, and there own investment company won't even invest in them, why should we?

Sid from Red Deer
said

Nice whining for Federal money Chrysler. Where did you learn that from, Bombardier?
"We need money, boo hoo hoo, so we can keep our jobs and make more stupid decisions."

Rob in Toronto
said

I think someone might need to clarify this "$70/h" thing. That is the total cost of the employee...that means hourly wage+pension+benefits+training+pay for another employee while this one takes his government mandated vacation and on and on and on. It's a budgetary number and hourly probably makes up something on the order of half.

Even your kid who makes $8/h is on the books with his employer for signifcantly more as an expense. No auto worker is carrying home an actual hourly wage anywhere near $70 an hour.

I think if people were honest about their own situations they would see that the math these companies throw around is not as impressive as they try to make it.

For my part I will say that $70/h doesn't even impress me. My employer pays an average hourly wage of between $30 - 40/h ...but by the time he makes his share of pension, health benifits, training, vacation, etc...well over $70/h.

Walking Man
said

D from Windsor

It would be typical of PM Harper/I wannabe a president, to give the bailout just to garner votes & stay in power, whether it be the right thing to do or not..... Let em go & good riddence... mho

John Tao from neudorf SK
said

I own a Dodge grand Caravan. Even though I shall be paying more for parts in the future I say: let them pull out (but not before paying us taxes due). Just the fact that they have taken this line of blackmail shows that no matter what Canadians shall sharply curtail buying their product in the future! Under the circumstances lending them money is a waste as their future in Canada is zilch.

Steven B
said

The time for unions in the private sector has long past. Talking to some GM workers and they agree stating that unions are a business entity of themselves, feeding off the members for their own growth.

It is very unfortunate and uncomfortable to think, but they GM and Crysler may need to file for bankruptcy protection. This will result in a level of restructuring, wage/benefit concessions, pension obligation relief and creditor negotiations that could not be obtained otherwise. Non-unionized management will also need to commit to the sames concessions with wage/benefit reductions mirroring the AVG concession received from it's employees.

Only then will the gov't be in a position to offer asset guaranteed loans with immediate payment due should they move out of Canada.

I agree with most, that less pay is better then no pay. I am not knocking any auto sector employee, but many do not have college/university education and it would be tough to find a job in life after GM/Chrysler that pays more the $12-15/hr at best. I am in Kitchener and have seen it here with many at the now closed auto frame manufacturing plant (nee Budd Canada).

Count your lucky stars for what you have enjoyed for many years, and then count them again for what you hopefully sill continue to have even at a 25% reduction in salary and benefits. Keep in mind the AVG Canadian income is well below $40K, so even with the concessions they are doing very well.

My honest opinion is that one of the "Big 3" must go! The North American auto manufacturers have too much capacity for too little demand. This maybe fine in the 70's when they commanded 80+% of the market share, but with less then 40% today there is no longer room for 3 in N.A.

rob rogers
said

Chrysler pulling out well that will help me in my next purchase.I currently drive a Jeep and have owned several chrysler vehicles next purchase will be from a company that still manufactures in canada period.

Rick in NB
said

Ya got to love the arrogance. When Chrysler was asked for a business plan, they dug thier toes in the ground and said ah shucks. Now Lasorda is threatening us.
We don't negociate with terrorist. Why entertain Lasorda's delusions.
Why is it that Cerberus Capital Management owns a majority of both GM and Chrysler. But told the US congress that they were not in the business bailing out the companies. They stated that it wasn't in the interest of thier investors.
So what i gather is happening is we pay the bill for private enterprise to proffer during a recession. If Clement give these clowns money than we deserve what our future deals us. We are Canada's investors.

kelly
said

Yes, I agree that the auto workers get paid way too much. But then so do the executives.

I say everyone at Chrysler needs to take a pay cut from the CEO all the way down to the lowest level before we should give them anymore money.
-or-
If they decide to move out of Canada, then no more Chrysler vehicles should be sold here.

Shawn
said

Let Chrysler go, not worth taxpayers money to save them. Also they knew all along what kind of crappy cars they build, how they overpaid their employees amd the big execs with their fat bonuses. They want to leave Canada, then go or better yet, Canada is telling you to leave, we don't want Chrysler here. If GM and Ford can survive, so can Chrysler.

Don Smith
said

if Chrysler goes back to the states th government should add a 8% surcharge to all their autos comming back into Canada

Who cares?
said

Let them go. Classic corporate threats - they've done it before, and if the taxpayer gives them more money, they will live to do it again...and again.

J. Pinsonneault Unity, SK.
said

Thjs is pure extortion by any other name. Chrysler should be encouraged to leave Canada to open the market to more scrupulous automakers. If they cannot compete - they shouldn't be in business here.

Red
said

I would be willing to take a 25% pay cut than a 100% pay cut. The last 3 months has been the auto companies and government trying to let the auto workers down easy, like a girlfriend breaking up with a crazy boyfriend. Too much, info too soon and you have a major crisis on your hands. The writing is on the wall! The powers to be are just making sure that when the *&^% hits the fan, our auto workers who have a history of being militant don't cause to much trouble. Our autoworkers, not all of them, have been living in a fantacy world that they are always owed something and untouchable. Take the 25% pay cut! It is not blackmail or a threat, it is reality. Try living in a tent city come October!

pinger
said

Now they want a break on taxes? How about no taxes? How about we clse the company and agree to pay you full wages forever? I want a break on the mismanagement and bloated overexcessive benefit plans approved by a board of directors that has been completely out of touch with reality. I want to fire the negotiator who agreed to the worker's demands so that they don't even pay into their own pension plans! (that's why it costs $70.00 per hour once you factor in all the hidden benefits) They've merely been tacking it onto the company and then onto the consumer! Well guess what Chrysler, the majority of Canadians don't like what you did to your own company, we don't like the exorbitant wages deals you signed last summer (and that have to now be clawed back in order for the company to survive), we don't like executives grossly inflated bonus plans, we don't like your executives flying in private jets to beg for taxpayers dollars and we don't like throwing good money after bad into a company that may well deserve to be swallowed up Ford or a GM or a Toyota. Car companies have been in trouble for years and that's why for the past 5 years we've seen so many joint mergers with companies like Land Rover, BMW etc. Did no one see the writing on the wall? Shame on you all for being nothing less than corporate welfare bums.

Mike B
said

Hey there Catzrulz.
Chrysler workers look at tHeir paycheque and say that ther dont make $70 - 75 an hour and in their minds that is true.
They dont make that amount directly.
BUT
They do indirectly.
What I mean is by the time you add in their hourly wages which average about $35 and hour and then add in their benefits and pensions and all the other little perks including the companies share of CPP etc it adds up to $70 - 75 an hour for the company to have them there. So yes indirectly they do maske that amount. The scarey part for me is that the CAW feels thats they have done well whith their so called concessions with GM. The only people that they are fooling is their member who will be out of a job because the CAW refuses to negotiate wage cuts. So again I say......
BYE BYE Chrysler
BYE BYE GM

Steve the Pundit
said

The longer this goes on the more I'm convinced that a bailout of Chrysler... is the wrong thing to do. Same for GM, if not more so. Use the money that would have been earmarked for the bailout to help pay the transition costs (EI, retraining, etc.)

People seem to think that, with no bailout, they would wake up one morning and these companies would just disappear into thin air. Let's be realistic; an orderly shut down or bankruptcy would take months, if not years, to orchestrate. All the while jobs would continue, cars would be made, dealers would sell them, pensioners would stil get paid, etc. The only thing different is all involved would be signing up for retraining, updating their resumes, adjusting their expectations, etc.

Nothing that either of these companies have done or said indicates that they have a viable, LONG-TERM business model. Enough is enough, let's wrap this party up.

Edwin from Toronto
said

Nobody cares how much the automakers are making if they did not ask other taxpayers to pay the bill.

Why subsidizing US companies for mis-managed business while allowing a Canadian Nortel to go bankrupt?

Nortel should start hiring. Once they have the same amount of employees in Canada as Chrysler, say 9,000, it can ask for government bailout. So easy to do business in Canada.

Yes, letting it shut down will affect other sector as well. If everyone expects economy and vehicle sales to rebound next year, other company will starting building again. Our EI will be sufficient for them to survive during this period.

The Canadian government should not let foreign private companies to put a gun to its head.

Sm4rtrth3nU
said

How much for Canada to buy Chrysler? should solve the tax dispute, and we wouldn't have to hear about them leaving Canada, ha ha

Sheldon Doyle Halifax
said

Go ahead let Chrysler leave Canada but if they do let them know that not another Chrysler vehicle will be sold on Canadian soil ever again.

So we'll do the same to all those who don't assemble in Canada.. Nissan, Volkswagen, Kia, Hyundai, Audi. BMW, Mercedes...and these guys never did!

James in New Brunswick
said

This is just plain foolishness. A company, like Chrysler, is in business to make money for its owners. Period. Full stop.

They do this by making sound business decisions about markets and favourable manufacturing conditions, like all those outlined by other posters above; Canada is a great place for a company to build stuff because of its proximity to the US market. If a company messes up and gets the market wrong, like Chrysler has, and no one is buying the product they should not be counting on the jurisdiction in which they are manufacturing the product to accommodate their crappy business decisions!

Let them go. Or better yet, tell them to get the heck out! It will hurt in the short term but we'll be better off in the long run without them.

roy
said

No taxpayer money went to save Studebaker when they weren't selling their cars so why should we save the big three , and oh by the way if we do bail out the auto sector ,the steel companies will be next with their hands out.

J. Armour
said

Chrysler leaving could present a new positive opportunity for Canada: Invite a Chinese auto company like Chery et al, to take over the former Chrysler's assembly line equipment and technology. (Chinese auto companies are already looking at opportunities to do this without taking on the added leagcy baggage of inefficient workers and, debt and pensions.

Davey boy
said

Don't even think about caving to these pathetic auto industry people. They got them selves into this mess, let them get out of it. People are resilient. We'll be OK. We'll probably swim better to safety without an anchor around our neck.

John Sam
said

Good Bye Chrysler. Welcome Canadian Cars, Japanese cars, French Cars, .. European Cars, Chinese Cars, Indian cars...

Samual
said

Put the bailout monies to building a CANADIAN AUTO industry let the foreign American auto companies go under. I won't buy gmc, ford or Chrysler, if the Canadian government gives one dime to usa auto. And definitely will never vote for a conservative government ever again.

Don in Dundas
said

I once owned a mini van and it will be the last Chrysler product I will ever own because of very poor reliability. Let them go now before they take any more of our money there are other manfacturers with much better attitudes towards quality, responsibility and customer satisfaction.

Glenn P
said

So go ahead and pull out Chrysler. Your products suck and if you think we, the tax payers are going to bail you out..think again. This is American "protectionism" at it's finest.1St US Steel pulling out of Hamilton to save jobs in PA & ALA and know they threaten to give the jobs to the people in MO?
Pay the money you owe and get the hell out of our country you yankee leech!!!!

Tommy - Toronto
said

Alert ! Chrysler is going Out. Stop buying Chrysler. 2 Billion are Enough for 10.000 workers of Chrysler. We dont need to give that money to Chrysler Group. Good bye.

Cassidy Kanata
said

La Sorda says wages need to be cut by 20% then cut the wages. La Sorda says Chrysler needs to be more competitive then get more competitive. GM right now is advertising new trucks with first 3 years service provided at no cost. Who might be subsidising that, the tax payer on the street who may be earning $10 an hour himself? I think this is all wrong. A business is run and a business is successful or the business restructures or fails. Canada does not need a "national automotive company in my opinion. I do not want my share of the tax dollars used in any form as a donation to the auto industry.

Randy
said

This is a double edged sword. If the auto makers don't get help, other companies and many many families will be affected, which will effect the rest of this country. But I also hate to see my hard earned tax dollars thrown at a bunch of workers who have been squeezing us for a very long time. Let the government help them out, but before they do, they need to make some real changes, and not just give up one week of spa time. Most of the people I know work a lot harder than the auto workers for a lot less.

Phil from Toronto
said

Let them die. This bailout plan will obviously not work. The only reason they are trying to save them is because if the car companies go bankrupt it will just compound the economic problems we are in. All the insured pensions will force more insurance companies and banks into bankruptcy as well which will officially send the world economy into depression. I say just get it over with so we can start rebuilding our failed "borrow now, pay never" society.

This would be hilarious
said

An earlier poster said that we should let CRYsler leave and maybe someone else would take over the plant. Wouldn't it be a kicker if Toyota or Honda took over the plant and made a profit?? No more tax payer money unless the LOAN also has a nice interest charge attached to it!!!

jon m
said

The Government is not going to bail the people of our country Canada. And we are losing our jobs.
so, now we the public cannot afford to buy a vehicle. So hypatheically speaking if they are going to fall, then do so, they need to restructure on their own accord and finaces. And if that is that is not possible then they need to go, it is what restructuring is all about. At the company level not at the publics expense.

Jerry out west
said

If chrysler owes the federal government back taxes , why doesn't the government take their plant as payment for those taxes , and offer it up to another automaker . The government has no problems jumping into hard working tax payers pockets and bank accounts for back taxes , take away their trump card and give it to someone else.

Jack from Windsor
said

People are just jealous on how much we autoworkers are making.

We need to maintain our cost of living and will not accept any reduction.

I need to maintain my salary to keep my 3,000 sq ft house, my cottage , 2 dogs and 2 kids.

Other sectors also rely on us to buy from them. If we stop spending, all restaurants in our town will close down.

All automakers are middle-class, although most of us only graduate from high school. We contributed a lot to our local communities as well.

The government loan will save our pay and job for the next few years.

We might get back to ask for more loan but the government better do it or else we might stop spending.

Maz
said

I'm getting tired of hearing about the woes of the auto industry. Canadians are paying too much for cars because of overpaid union workers. The ride is over boys! Get used to a "smartcar" wage like everyone else!

Ron in the West
said

Let 'em go and leave Canada. Not one penny of taxpayers money PLEASE to support workers earning a package worth $70 per hour and a company and management who don't know their a**es from a hole in the ground. They will fold up like a cheap suit regardless and take our tax money with them as they ride into oblivion. Remember years ago that Chrysler filed for bankruptcy while the entire auto sector was doing great. Why would you think they could survive in bad times? And to those who say if Chrysler leaves they will never buy another Chrysler vehicle...idiots!. You should never buy one even if they stay...unless you get a thrill out of buying crap!

GD
said

Hi Everyone

I wonder how they arrived at the 70 dollars an hour. Hey these are good paying jobs and we need them. Take away the good paying jobs and you have Mexico. No matter what anyone says this is blackmail. I would suggest that the government put out a statement that if they want to leave they should go but there products will not be allowed in Canada. If you take there products out of Canada the other auto com pays will simply sell more of their products thus need more workers to build them. this is not protectionism just good sense.

My two cents.

Rick in NB
said

I like the idea of The Canadian Car Company.
Once we built a proto type jet. We built it so well the US cowed us into scrapping it. All the workers ended up at NASA and won JFK's space race.
We have the workers we have the factories. Why not go for it.

I Remember When....
said

Back in 1987, GM initially planned on closing its Ste. Therese assembly plant, which would've put thousands of employees out of work. Opened in 1965, Ste. Therese was Quebec's only automotive assembly plant, and was a key contributor to Quebec's economy. The Quebec government was willing to go the extra mile to keep it open. Both the government of Quebec and the government of Canada along with the local Canadian Auto Workers union stepped in with an almost irresistible package for GM. The governments granted GM a 220 million dollar (Canadian) interest-free loan, payable in 30 years. Both the Quebec and Ottawa governments each contributed 110 million each. GM also was awarded over 100 million dollars in tax breaks to keep the plant open. They took the money and ran, closing the plant and Crysler will do the same.... let them go!

Dave P.
said

My response to Chrsyler's threats would simply be this; See Ya!!! and Remember Mr. LaSorda your products will never be sold in Canada ever again.

James
said

The answer is simple: Criminalize the CAW and their lockstep, strong-arm pig-headed mode of thinking. They act like they deserve this free ride through life at everyone's expense (framed within their propaganda induced ideology). Time to re-think their usefulness to our society.

I was smart enough NOT to get stuck with a crappy union job and I don't even have a university degree; so don't talk to me about opportunity or lack thereof. Oh and I'm responsible for my own pension and well being when I retire, not the rest of you (taxpayers). I say to throw the bums out.

Alanna , Saskatchewan
said

I say don't put taxpayers money into a company that is going to bail anyway. It would be a huge waste. I know it would be difficult for the employees but hey, all those stikes when they kept asking for higher wages, better benifits and pensions----that's where the mess was started.

Mike in Ottawa
said

So This is what our illustrious Minister gets paid for, to make obvious statements. Some times it would "Seem" that this Government is the last to know the things that the rest of us have know for months.. Tsk Tsk Tsk

Nancy
said

If Canadian Taxpayers think for a moment that these so called "loans" to automakers will ever be repaid they are sadly mistaken. The auto industry in N.A. is a joke. Clement suggests that production would have to remain at current levels. Isn't this a fundamental part of the problem...........too much inventory, not enough buyers. The N.A. automakers may have placated themselves for a while with their false economy crated through 0% leasing and financing. Now it's time to pay the piper. If these executives were unable to manage their company's own money, why would we give them ours.

The Hammer
said

If CAW and their unionized workers are adamant that Canadians know nothing about their wages versus costs, then come clean and post your contract and break it down into layman terms that normal people understand versus the legal jargon that is usually bantered about in the news conferences from both sides. Then we will judge exactly what is what.

If the CEo of Chrysler states that it's the same costs for workers and pensioners alike, then that can only mean that once a worker retires, then they get 100 % of the same benefits and take home salary they did when they were working.

If this is so, then I know of no other job that pays a person 100 % in pension returns based on what they were making as an employee.

Everyone knows from past experiences with companies like this. We the taxpayer provide funding, the company bank rolls it into some other non company account and them goes bankrupt after a few months, leaving us holding the bag.

To Dave From Windsor, it's not hard to read between the lines. Your either a CAW member or are related to people who are. Chrysler makes junk I know I had an Intrepid that blew 3 transmissions in a year and one with only 1500 kms. on it. Never ever will I buy another Chrysler piece of crap. And I am not alone who harbour those feelings to their products.

Let them go. We'll survive as a country without them.

Sam from Victoria, bc
said

To comment on David's comment, if people of winsor needs jobs so badly, MOVE!!! Or even better, instead of giving the money to Chrysler which by the way are the worst cars I ever drove, (I own a dodge caravan which I hate with passion), they should take that bail out money and finance a NEW company that makes EV plug in cars and put all these workers to work in the new factory. Here's a worthy investment!!

People let that bad bad bad company go. They have been scamming people for too long now with their cheap vehicles.

Don't get me wrong though, I do actually feel bad for people from Winsor because they are humans like me, have their families to feed, houses to pay cars to drive etc... However, this is reality, this is life which tends to throw everything at you at the same time. IF it is such a difficult time, then UNITE and WORK TOGETHER to find a solution instead of relying on the government. They have already a lot on their plate without having to deal with people that just point at the problem without trying to find a solution.

I say, people of Winsor, you have the engineers at that plant, you have the main workforce, Unite your strength and build something else with your expertise. Ask the government to expel chrysler from canada and use their factory to build something better. Something Canadians will be proud of driving!

That's my 2 cents

Nicole in Saskatoon
said

How about we start our own Canadian owned and operated car company??? Maple Motors??? Haha the Gov't can use the billions of dollars to do that rather than give it away... Don't let the door hit you on the way out Chrysler.

Mary Clarke
said

DesRosiers, president of DesRosiers Automotive Consultants, said yesterday the three groups don't believe freezes in wages and extra costs for health care are sufficient to qualify for more than $6 billion in government loans.

They also think public assistance in shoring up the company's pension shortfall is inappropriate, DesRosiers said in a note to clients.

"These groups are wrong on all these perceptions. All of these items and the many others negotiated are `transformational' and will save hundreds of millions.

"But they don't accept this and don't understand this and they have been `spun' so many times in the past they have a hard time believing GM when told the opposite."

DesRosiers, who appeared before a parliamentary subcommittee last night, said he senses the extent of concessions will create trouble for GM in its bid for aid.

"I hope I'm wrong, but I'm very worried that GM misread public sentiment and that this whole thing might blow up in their face," DesRosiers said.

"In the meantime, we should support what GM did with their labour agreement and hopefully Ford and Chrysler will address these very visible irritants in their negotiations."

DesRosiers said the public can't understand why GM workers didn't lose all their special holidays plus company funding for legal bills, child care and tuition, since many employees in the country don't have such benefits.

Furthermore, he said GM workers don't contribute to their own pension plan, but now the company wants the Ontario government to help cover a huge shortfall.

"How does a politician explain to a taxpayer who has lost a third to half of their RRSP contributions that they have to cover part of the liability of the CAW pension fund when these workers don't contribute to their own pensions," he said

Deb, Orangeville Ont.
said

The frustration at the extortion from Chrysler LLC is understandable. What I don't understand is the animosity and hatred for the people on the line. Is it jealousy people say they would do the job for half the money. Believe it or not its hard work and after years of repetition it takes a toll. People less than 40 years old that are permanently injured and will never recover from their injuries. An analogy to understand life on the line: many people go to the gym and lift weights. Many do 2-3 sets of 15-20 reps. People on the line do 400 plus reps a day. Most athletes have a 24 to 48 hr rest period before exercising those same muscles line workers do not. Yes we enjoy many benefits and a good wage but I have seen people who have spent 30 years on the line and their bodies are broken and many have lost full use of some of their body parts. Take those 400 plus repetitious movements per day and multiply that by just 10 years and tell me about how easy it is. I know this is not going to stop the hate mongering that is going on but hopefully it will illustrate that this work is not as easy as some would like to believe.
I will guarantee you that if the big 3 go under it won't be long til your employers are coming to you asking for concessions and wage cuts because of slumped sales.

Justine
said

If Chrysler leaves Canada, they are going to cut their own throats. No one will buy another Chrysler/Dodge vehicle...if they do, they are supporting these greedy people. Who makes that kind of money without a university degree of some kind? This is ridiculous. The cash cow will always run out of milk eventually! Put her out to pasture!!

Maple Leaf Forever, Calgary
said

Manufacturing in Canada is dying, and it is not just specific to the auto industry. If Canada is to maintain an auto industry, we need to invest now in the research, development, and green technologies of ths industry. Give (or loan) $2 billion each to Toyota, Honda, and even Ford, and stipulate that they must improve the efficiency of their Canadian operations (and thus retain minimum employment levels), and that they must set up high tech R&D centres in areas like Windsor, ON, hard hit by GM and Chrysler's pending demise.

Would you invest your own money in a company that is losing billions? No, you would invest in the company making money, and offering a high quality product, as that is the one that will pay the most dividends down the road.

Ottawa and Ontario need to think long term growth and prosperity, and I'm afraid that doesn't seem to include Chrysler.

Pip
said

Let's give Chrysler the loan, to keep the jobs; but ONLY after the corporation and holding company have paid their taxes.

Problem is, Cerberus and Chrysler LLC want to keep paying a dividend, even though they can't sell their vehicles. Time to cut the divident to nothing and invest IN the company, instead of just taking out. R&D into new engineering, not just better mousetraps, would work wonders. The Japanese and European manufacturers did that, and are in nowhere near the same state as the big three.

Alysha Ont
said

My husband worked for GM but quit 30 yrs ago. At that time, the Unions demanded so much at contract time that I could not fathom what their next demands would be at contract time. They didn't care about the other working men and women in other industries who didn't have a Union but they only cared about bleeding everything they could out of the Company GM. I said then that Unions would destroy Companies in this country with their greed. We now see the results of Unions and what they have done to companies under the threat of strikes!
GM and Chrysler on the other hand knew their situation and yet paid out millions to their executives with salaries and bonuses who were there to manage the company! A High price to pay. The working men and women always get screwed in the end ! Sad !

Peter 1951
said

You have to love the autoworker, their jobs and their industry is on the brink on being non existent, and they are holding a vote to see if they except the contract offer that is on the table, how stinking stupid can a person be. They say they didn’t create the world economic problems and they are right, but they are 100% the cause of the big three auto industries problems, and it starts right from the top CEO position right down to the person that scrubs the floors in the lunch room at the auto plant. The greed of these autoworkers and there union, with their out of this world wages, has made it almost impossible for the average man or women to buy a north American made vehicle. At $70 dollars an hour, for the workers as well as the one’s on their pensions, it is costing the Auto industry approximately $140 thousand per year for wages and pension benefits per person. Are the autoworkers so greedy that they don’t realize that the people buying their cars are making in the $12 to $25 per hour range? Well you know the old saying what goes around comes around, and it has come around full force and has hit the autoworker right where it hurts the most, right in the wallet. Well get ready to join the real world where the wages are a much smaller and we live from cheque to cheque, and we do it without whining day in and day out. Don’t look for any pity from this Canadian, because it doesn’t matter if you get bailed out money or not, your greed is still going to kill the “BIG THREE”. Enjoy your “BIG UNION” vote it is sure to be your last.

Marc in Ottawa
said

Time go go back & view the news reals..Ross Perreault, former US Presidential candidate said if Nafta were passed you would hear the wooosh sound as manufacturing plants moved to Mexico. In the end, free trade means relocating all possible medium and large scale manufacturing to where the people are the poorrest. It works in the short term but is a disaster in a decade.....and here we are at the decade marker..

Dean in YYZ
said

Hey listen up all you clowns out there.

It was never the intentions of this conservative government to bail these over paid over benefited auto workers out in the 1st place.

All you socialist loving idiots and Liberal lovers are the 1's who where screaming for the government to do somthing.

So what now, the truth hurts doesn't it.Reality people, what you thought it was all a joke and that it wouldn't cost much?

Time to pay the PIPER.

Can't have it both ways ONTARIANS.

You LOVE your usless liberal party so much.

Well it's all come home now to bite you all right in the ASS.

What you expect miracles now from Mr.Harper?

Well it's not going to happen.

Scaming and weaseling can only work for so long.(LIBERAL PARTY..1993 to 2004)now you know what has hit the fan.

But fear not,the brave and the strong will once again take over and fix this F'n mess.

Chris in Ontariariari-Oh!
said

This is merely more talk than substance as these negotiation's continue it will become more clear as to what is expected of all party's involved.Chrysler seem's to be a little slower out of the gate as far as putting together a feasible action plan than has G.M. so far it seem's to have been more difficult for the government to arrive at anything firm from them.Chrysler actually exceed's the current 20% baseline of Canadian content the Canadian government is seeking so it may be more difficult for them to factor this in when product line and mix are considered.These are difficult negotiation's and it seem's the government isn't going to just hand the money over without some assurance's which is good new's as nobody want's to see tax dollar's wasted.
Chrysler received government loan's in the early eighty's when they were facing bancruptcy to help them re-tool Windsor assembly for the launch of the highly successful mini van this resulted in a huge success story for Chrysler.Maybe that is kind of development's
the government want's to see now from them.They have a good opportunity as they have the European connection's with Fiat and in the past with Diamler.They have electric vehicle's coming on line in 2010 and the probability of increasing their product line with some fuel efficient euro diesel's.I would say that they could do quite well should they get over the hump so to speak.Let's hope they can work out an arrangement that satisfy's the need's of the Canadian government and the consumer.That way everyone win's.

Mike in Ontario
said

Let's see - if any business owner in Canada owed HALF A BILLION dollars in unpaid taxes, and then went to the government for more money & with the aggressive attitude that Mr.Lasorda appears to be doing, what do you think would happen?

But oh no, they continue to demand taxpayers' money with a gun to our heads, at a time when even Chrysler's corporate owners won't invest further.... what more do we need to say as taxpayers to call this for what it is? Politically it's a no-win situation, so make the long-term decision that's best for all Canadians - not just those in Windsor & Brampton. We all pay taxes & we all get a vote - remember that.

Come on folks - it's time to realize that Chrysler's gonna bail on Canada either way, but they would prefer to leave with pockets of our cash if possible. Either that or they will blame the government for not bailing them out. Yes, Windsor & Brampton will suffer unfortunately - but the inevitable is upon us.

And then there were two.

sam
said

Stop buying Chrysler vehicles. Let the country they move to support them. See how that fares for them. Jackasses!

bunny
said

I think they can get workers for cheaper( and no unions) in Mexico! but before they go.a) no more money to them! b) they owe us tax- get it !

Pat Guelph
said

Chrysler pulling out may be just the start of things to come. Obama and his Democrats are "protectionist" They beleive in "Made in America" They don't want our steel or our "dirty oil" but don't object to their own dirty coal. It won't be long before Obama screws this country. Besides sending Chrysler packing, we could threaten to cut them off from our natural gas, dirty oil and electricity. This could turn ugly.

Al
said

Just had it. Even if we were to paid the 5000 so called workers $52,000.00 a year this would only cost the tax payer 2 to 3 hundred million a year for these workers to sit on there ass, not the billions that is requested. The tax payer would also benefit on the taxes that would be paid on this money, example taxes would be contributed back in to the tax system.
Chysler will go, someone else will fill the void.
GM & chrysler has had it to good for to long and its time for the companys to Shit or get off the pot and let more innovative companies fill the void.

For the goverment, there should be provision for tax payers to refuse paying taxes, if the goverment chooses to speding our money foolishly.
The party that puts this to a bill in the house will get my vote.
Support small bussiness, by far they are the one who employee most of the work force.

Pierreh
said

So far I have yet to see any industry or union proposal which includes a repayment lan for the bail ot loans. I sure hope that the government will have the nerve to turn down any bailout proposal which does not include a repayment timetable. As for threats from Chrysler, I would point out to them that they have failed so far to meet any dealine set by either the US or Canadian government for a restructuring plan that had any meet in it. I'd send hm back to do their homework.

Davey boy
said

If you want a Majority Government Stephen Harper DON'T bail out the auto sector. Set your self as a smart prudent leader. Don't listen to those pro auto cones around you. You'll be surprised at the large amount of support you will have Country wide.

Sm4rtrth3nU
said

Cerberus paid Daimler $7.4 billion for Chrysler. The government should buy the canadian leg of Chrysler from Cerberus after they go belly or after Cerberus decides to chop it up (which is what they will ultimately do anyway). Should be able to buy it for significantly less than the $2 billion they are trying to extort from us now. I don't suggest our government run the company lol, but they could help transition the remains to become employee owned and operated. If Chrysler can't make money then, well forget it and let's then not put any more tax payer money into it. Btw, an employee owned Chrysler should equate to no more CAW in the Chrysler plants, everyone wins

Don
said

I wouldn't buy a Chrysler product if you gave me one. I couldn't afford the repairs on the crap they sell. More bailout money = more lousy products that people won't buy.

Stephen
said

I feel sorry for the workers trying to servive. But there unions got them the big wages as well the mismanagement of the company itself. It is easy to go and ask the tax payers ( government) to supply a loan. These companies should go to the private sector to raise the funds if they are serious in staying in buisness. Maybe the employees would like to invest in there company as well to help keep it afloat. I suspect they don't because they do not feel it is a good investment. So why should taxpayers money be put out to support any company that their own employees and other private businesss will not back. The companies suggestion of moving operations back to the US if they don't get government support is like the little person who has the only ball in the game. If you don't give me what I want, I will take my ball and go home. I say if they are serious in staying in Canada they will find away with out blackmailing the govenments and the people of Canada

Chris in Kingston
said

$70 an hour? Wow. Here's some news for the CAW: Take a $20 an hour pay cut, or take a $70 pay cut which leads to the unemployment line. No wonder a new van costs upwards of $30,000 CAD.

Vince M
said

Chrysler is a pivate US company. It isn't traded on the stock market in either country. It's parent company Ceberus has $30 billion in assets. Why is the Canadian taxpayer putting any money into this at all?

Joel in Kamloops
said

Let Chrysler go. Retrain the workers and invest in sustainable companies. And sue them for the taxes they owe us - or seize the plant and all manufacturing tools inside.

Irma
said

I can't say that I like Chrysler's attitude and threats. Reality: business goes in cycles and there's a depression coming, they won't be the only people to go belly-up. If Chrysler isn't selling many vehicles, then, well, um, let's see, maybe they are currently not a viable organization. Do they want bailouts and guarantees for the next few years? Taxpayers will have no money left to buy any vehicles after being taxed to death to pay for these corporate whiners who didn't manage their finances properly and who gave in to the unions. Take your medicine and just go bankrupt. Good riddance.

Dodge lover
said

I bought Chrysler all my life ,if i have to buy something else to save tax payers dollars , so what

kate
said

Can we please stop with the articles on Auto bail outs please? Approximately 80% of all Canadians don't support them and don't give a crap about them..let them leave please, we'll drive you in our Honda's right over the border!! The rest of us are trying to make ends meet and worrying about our own meager jobs.

Ben
said

This is a very irresponsible statement at this time

Don
said

Here it is in a nutshell. The government can throw 1 trillion dollars at the big three car companies. It wont change one basic fact. We are in a recession. People are not buying cars. If the government wants to help, how about waving all sales tax on new cars, plus money to scrap old ones.

Tony
said

It's THEIR way or the HIGHWAY!

It's all about money and power. Corporations down south can take over own companies and gamble away our manufacturing plants.

Edwin from Toronto
said

Chrysler is absolutely right.

It should manufacture products in a jurisdiction that is most competitive.

Move all production to China or India, where you can find workers willing to accept $1 per hour.

guppies
said

We will be very busy. If everyone say I am leaving if they don't get help from the Fed. (Which is our taxpayer money).

If they build better car. They don't have to ask for help today.

I watch a show yesterday call saving GM...The CEO got pay 16 millions on 2007 and GM is losing millions that year. And look at the new yesterday how Citigroup spend the Americian taxplayer money.

Harper - watch out !!!
if you make a boo boo.
You are the first one to leave not Chryler

Sick of these Car makers...
said

I do not think any taxpayer money should go to a company who is threatening to shut down the Canadian division.

Let's face it. They need us more than we need them right now.

This tactic shows how low Chrysler can go.

Chrysler should not only have to prove it's intent to remain operational but prove how it plans on remaining operational before it gets one red cent.

Time for the boys in the playground to grow up.

I for one am sick of the BS coming out of the mouths of the automakers in Canada.

Get with the program, re-org, cut your top brass, lower wages, build more economical cars and trucks, get moving on the hybrids and electric cars.

You guys know what to do, you just don't want to spend the stake holders cash to do it, you want another hand out since they are so easy to get.

Recession, bull shit it is all big company greed that is causing these problems.

My view ~ Kiss Chrysler Goodbye!
said

They owe CRA $1,000,000,000 in back taxes....

They think the CAW will drop $20/hr on a new contract? (are they nuts?!)

LaSorda is dreaming in Technicolor....

Last and certainly not least they make arguably the worst quality products of the Big 3 and deserve to go under.

Jack from Windsor
said

WE autoworkers absolutely unwilling to work for $20 per hour less.

Although we have full medical coverage and full pension on retirement, our body is exhausted putting in screws repetitively everyday.

The loan we asked for will be able to save thousand of jobs in our plants. Making us able to pay property taxes, go to restaurants, raise our dogs and kids for the next few years.

We don't care if our company can repay the loan or not.

We knew our company cannot be profitable and will come back to taxpayers for more money. We don't care what other taxpayers think but the government has to save our industry, no matter what.

Those jealous people, no use to cry out loud for our good salary & benefit. We will get what we ask for anyway.

Deborah
said

People should also know that someone like my mother who is a surviving spouse of a former GM employee only gets $600 + benefits a month. She isn't getting my dad's full pension. My dad always hated the union.. he used to say they were overpaid and overworked but he went in did his job. If your boss turned around and gave you $70 hr including benefits would you take it or tell them to keep it because you thought they were overpaying you (I wouldn't)?

The Auto sector has gotten themselves into this on their own. The workers got the benefits and pay the COMPANY give them.

Steve in Ottawa
said

Hmm, question.. can a Canadian company operating in the U.S. walk up to Congress and demand U.S. bailout cash? I don't think so...
To Chrysler (i.e. foreign, non-Canadian entity):
1. Be thankful for any Federal assistance you could/would get, because there are many Canadian companies that deserve Canadian bailouts before any foreign entity should get one. That's how "protectionist" USA see's it now, too, right?
2. So you leave Canada. Marketing suicide? Take a guess as to how fast another auto company will rush to fill the market share you leave behind...a market share you'll probably not get back.

JD
said

Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out of Canada. You build over priced junk anyway - not a penny of my tax dollars should go to your firm.

Stunned In Alberta
said

I'm curious to know what is stopping the big names at Chrysler from stuffing their pockets with million dollar bills and then leaving anyways? How much money have they received in the past few years or so, people are still being laid off, yet bonuses for top exec's are 30 million to stay on through 2009? Let alone the billions they are demanding now? Hum, I wonder what will happen at the end of 2009? Is this not what happened with all the investment banks in the US?

My goodness I can't even believe this hostage negotiation is even being considered. Is our government really that blind?

Edwin from Toronto
said

There are better alternatives for making use of bailout money.

The big 3 are US companies. Our government don't even bailout forestry and other local businesses. Our logic seems that any company hiring more people will get government money.
All US automakers are losing market shares to Japanese automakers. That indicates they are not competitive in terms of pricing and quality. Why don't we subsidiing Japanese automakers to buy all facilities in Canada and build all vehicles here? I am sure they will stay much longer in Canada than US automakers. China and India carmakers are aggressively seeking opportunities to sell cars in North America. It is a good chance for them if we can provide incentives for them to build cars in Canada.
Demand for vehicles in Canada is not sufficient to drive up production of vehicles. Any tax incentive or rebates for buying new vehicles is useless to save the auto industries.
I can say the 90% of other taxpayers will not agree giving their hard earned tax money to maintain salary of autoworkers making more than $70 per hour, while a similar educated person earning less than $10 per hour in a restaurant.
The amount of bailout loan requested is more than enough to extend the EI eligible period by another 52 weeks. This benefit all canadians and more than sufficient time for the economy to recover.
The problem with GM is not demand. They sold the most cars in the world before 2008 but still making loss before the crisis. Their business model or management is not viable. MP supporting bailout will face the political consequence if they come back next year for more loan.

Edwin from Toronto
said

I suggest everyone write to their MPs to object the bailout.
Check out the points in my previous comment

LAL
said

OMG people!!! This is just another contract ploy. General Motors did the same thing not weeks ago as a bargaining chip. The Suits in the nice offices are going to take their toys and go home if the union doesn't agree to everything the suits want, which is continuing to count their multi-million dollar salaries and bonuses.

If people insist on making ridiculous comments on this issue, at least have the decency to educate yourselves on the facts. The ignorance regarding this issue is phenomenal and an insult to the intelligence of those that actually know the facts.....

Remarkable
said

The unions over the years has held a knife at the big 3's throat, threatening to walk and strike until they bring those companies down.

Sure, those companies then were making good profit, but profit must be reinvested to keep companies competetive, but the unions demanded huge pay increases, huge wages, huge benefits and on and on it went.

Well, now that the tables are turned, the big 3 auto makers have the knife at the unions throat and now, if there aren't major concessions on wages and benefits, they'll just simply close the doors and walk.

If Chrysler wishes to keep their business going and if the union and it's members wish to keep their jobs, then they had better get back to the bargaining tables asap, otherewise, they'll have nothing to talk about, accept how long the line ups have become at the EI offices.

guppies
said

Lots of Canadian got layoff now. All industies not only auto working.

We are in Recession. Even the feb. dumping tons and tons of money to the GM and Chrysler. Is just like a sucker bet. And what about the other industries ?

This wouldn't help us to get out the recession any faster.
If the auto working making $ 25+ or more before. They should wake up. Those days are gone. The union just sucking out money from you.
Take a paid cut and hope it rebound later. At least you still have a job.

We are not buying any auto now. Even so, I wouldn't get a GM or Chrysler anyway.

I own both GM and Chryler before. I have 6 yrs of nightmare with them.

The problem with Harper govt. today is. He will throw money to all sector that he will get votes if there is another election.

If any company out there still want to open for business tomorrow. They will cut pricing to get the customer back.

Example : Look at an LCD tv list price is $ 2999.00 and they can sell to you under $ 1999.00. There is a lot of margin to move.

Mike formerly from Windsor
said

I saw the greediness of the CAW in Windsor for years who protected lazy workers who took for granted that people would always buy new vehicles every few years. CAW Workers live lavish lifestyles with "spa weeks", bonuses, long vacation and automatic EI when the plants shut down for the summer. Don't blame the CEOs. They are the ones that pay the taxes, operating costs and R&D to keep their company in competition. The good life is over. I hope they all saved their surplus money and now they will learn how to really earn their money like the rest of us.

MUN grad
said

All I know is that , I make 57,000 a year , I have a Degree that I worked hard for , if the company that employees me where to go under today , I would be on my onw , no bailout .

Simnple math here , if you work 37.5 hours a weeks a even 40.00 an hour before taxes thats 75000 a year at 50 weeks ?? come on for working shift work on a line ?

Brian
said

Both the CAW and Chrysler need to give their heads a shake. For Chrysler to lay out their "demands" to the Federal Government is a total joke. Seems to me that a better approach would be for them to come "cap in hand". As far as CAW is concerned, they need to come to the realization that they are a much bigger part of the problem than they have been prepared to acknowledge. Freezing wages until 2012 isn't going to cut it. They need to dig much deeper if they want to save these jobs.

Don Calgary
said

I wish I was making $70.00 an hour. The unions are too strong. Check out what union leaders are making. A young person starting out at most places is only making $10.00 - $20.00 per hour with no package deals. Get real union people look at the real world times are tough and prices are up

kg1
said

Hey Chrysler: Dont let the door hit you on the way out. As a rule Canada doesnt generally pay hostage takers. As for the autoworkers at Chrysler. Jealous of you, I think not. P---ed off at you is more like it. Welcome to the real world of getting paid what you are really worth and not what you think you are worth

Paul B
said

Bye!

JP
said

@stu

Agreeing with stu 100%. This is total, utter madness and insanity. Those words have not enough meaning to describe it. Why are the taxpayers on the line for a companies shortfall? Since when are private companies' losses a social welfare problem, but their profits are private? This is madness.
If Cerberus wanted it to survive in Canada, they would make it happen. But hey don't.
The don't because our monetary system favours cheap (or preferably free) labour, and some one or few people at the top will get a multi-million dollar bonus for saving Cerberus the money of operation in Canada. They will move to Mexico or China.

For the love of all that is good and fair, our government needs to LET THEM FAIL!

Hannah
said

Hasn't our government bailed out Chrysler one too many times already? This is blackmail and I thought that was against the law. By the way, what is the CEO of Chrysler getting in wages and expenses? Is HE taking a wage cut?

JP
said

To all the people who retort about 70/hr being too much.

IS IT TOO MUCH!! Dimwits!! ALL OF OUR salaries are given to us that way, with the excess costs of benefits and pensions and retirement contribution included!
And the answer is that most of us DO NOT MAKE 70/hr with all our excess benefits and union expenses included!!!
So stop trying to justify it!

John Royle, Ontario
said

Everyone is slamming Tom LaSorda for stating what is an obvious truth! ..... the ridiculous contract concessions are just not enough and the man has stated so however unsavoury it sounds! ........ this will give this Lewenza client the chance now to go for the jugular and bring the workforce out on strike! ...... this will bring about capitulation by the Federal and Provincial Governments and all should be well! ......

Gayle
said

Chrysler and its Investment Firm owners and its Home Depot cast off need to take their threats, and their business somewhere where they care. Canadians are sick of paying for these companies corporate wages. Dont let the door hit you on the A#$%%@% on the way to Mexico.

the old lady
said

Probably the union should make concessions to help us over the mess we are in.

I also think every elected person and every one working for the Government and all Teachers should take at least a 20% cut in wadges and benefits. We are all in this together and every one should help.

Craig.
said

Apparently it needs to be said again. NOBODY makes $70 and hour at Chrysler, Ford, G.M, Nissan, Honda, etc. This figure represents the cost of the hourly wage (more like $25.00), the cost of health insurance (drug plans, etc), long and short term insurance coverage, and pension contributions.

To those that actually think that someone makes $70.00 per hour, as an hourly wage...your head is stuck somewhere. My God, the cheapest car a company like that could produce to even break even would be over $100K!! Are you all really that stupid??? You're starting to make comments that sound like under-educated Americans...it's embarassing.

Paul
said

Too Bad Chrysler!
As one of this country's taxpayer, I feel that the CEO of Chrysler made a treat and that is unacceptable behaviour coming from someone who holds such a position. It is much easier to capture a bear with honey, so I recommend that the gentleman should offer an appology to Canada as a whole and present his case again without pointing fingers and for someone looking for help use a bit of humility. C'mon lets face it why the industry in such a shambles to start with..?

Rick in NB
said

It doesn't matter what you think of trade unions in this post.
My point here is that Lewenza is handling Lasorda the way he should. When a bully threatens you. don't walk away, you stand up to the Lasordas of the world. Not like Micael Bryant's comment on how great a Canading Lasorda is. makes me puke!

Rick in NB
said

Alice
said

I feel sorry for the workers at the big 3 trying to raise a family and juggle family, football and soccer practice. This anger is not directed at you.

LH
said

To Tom: to say that not another chrysler product will be sold on canadian soil is not realistic. canadians buy cars not made on canadian soil, or without a manufacturing plant even existing in canada all the time. why should the big 3 be punished for pulling out of canada? do we punish all manufacturers who don't produce here?
To the CAW: many people in many industries have been forced to take a pay cut or to take a reduction in their work hours so they again take home less money, why shouldn't you? This is a crisis, isn't it better to have a job at less pay than no job at all? Ask all the people who just lost their jobs, I'm sure many would rather have taken a pay cut then lost their job entirely. And as many have noted, most of us don't receive a pension or minimal if any benefits, many of you are already overpaid, maybe when you join the unemployment line you will realize how good you have it, even if you did take a pay cut.

s. timms
said

If Chrysler were to leave Canada it will have a hugh impact on many things which Im sure we have all heard already, but there are several things that can be done to help out such as, when both spouses work for the company only one should be able to have the benefits, why cant they pay say $5.00 for prescriptions, why does the company allow individuals that get caught abusing substances at work come back after re-hab whatever number of times, massage therapy really isn't necessary, the fee per month towards their medical expenses is a good idea and so is giving up Xmas bonuses, and dont think Im jealous of these auto workers my husband is one of them, I think we all have to give a little if we want the jobs saved.

rick in Calgary
said

If the automakers could trim the trim down their labour force and make the cars a little cheaper, the bailout package would go much further..... or deeper into the pockets of management, the ones who really know the value of money. Why should a worker even think to expect a wage that provides for the family and future nowdays. Those days are long gone.

Mike
said

No more extortion from the Auto Unions. I'm sick and tired of overpaying for inferior vehicles to finance the university education of an Auto Worker with a grade 10 education. The next time that I see these idiots they will be asking me if I want Fries with that order. Looks good on them.

Mar
said

If you read the article they say that it equals $70/hr including pension and benefits, not $70/hour outright. Many auto workers do make less than this, and I know that GM for one has it set up that all new workers will not make near that (unless they are skilled workers or specialized and deserve that kind of money and would make that anywhere they worked). The auto makers are trying to reduce these burdens, but the CAW lives in fantasy land about what they are worth. I guess no job is better than taking a pay cut. good luck with that!

Jack from Windsor
said

I urged all union auto workers not to back off on wage cuts.

We should fight for keeping $70 per hour

Chryler will keep the plant in Canada. If they want the make cars in US, they will not close the US plant a few years ago. They are using tactics to persuade us to back off.

The government's request for a business plan is just a stepping stone or excuse for them to grant us the loan.

No politician can bear the consequence of letting us go bankrupt, especially the Liberals & NDP. For PC, they will not give the bullet to the opposition by not granting the loan.

The government will give us the loan under any circumstances.

We should ask for salary increase instead.

Hannah
said

did some research: Chrysler is 80% owned by a private US investment conglomerate, 20 % owned by a German company and as of Jan/2009, Italy's company Fiat is buying 35% of Chrysler. Who exactly is borrowing Canadian Funds?

Glenn
said

Good-bye Chrysler. It was nice knowing ya.

Shawn
said

If Chrysler and GM think they can bully Canadian tax payers by theatening to leave if they don`t get billions, "GO then".

Get out of Canada and don`t come back, there are lots of other manufactures of car we can buy from. Hershey just did the same thing and look how they sales and shares dropped.

If worker are to take a $20 pay cut to keep their jobs FINE but make sure managment takes the same cuts.

And lets get rid of that stinkin CAW as well before we are all broke, their 1940s thinking is killing industry in this country.

Serge in Hamilton
said

I've driven the product. I've seen what $70/h get you and they should be ashamed. Build a better vehicle and maybe sales will go up. As for save the company, just give all the tax payers the money you would use to bail them out and let them buy a different product. Economy wins, mediocrity looses.

Rick from Winnipeg
said

If Chrysler or Gm want government loans they should open all financial books, unrestricted, for a detailed audit by the government so the taxpayers can see if the risk is worth the reward.

James T.
said

I hope Chrysler does leave Canada. And as for the greedy union members who drove the company to the brink of bankruptcy but who are unwilling to make any concessions? If they don't want to make cars, then let them make fries...

I'll have a large order of Curly Fries and a Coke with no ice. Hop to it, Skippy. There ain't no "Job Bank" for the paper hat crowd!

Edwin from Toronto
said

$70 per hour including benefit converted to $127,400 per year without benefit.

Working only 7 hours per day, 5 days a week.

Anyone university graduate will accept this salary as self-employed contractor, without any benefit.

Are union members living in our world?

Mike
said

In the end we all know that Chrysler will pull out of Canada. Don't waste our money and invest in something that will create jobs.

Kelly
said

When you are in a union and being this over paid sympathy is out of the question. If they want to continue and argue themselves out of jobs so be it...That stupidity, which could be likened to natural selection, is something only a too powerful union can protect. PUH-LEAZE!

SlackJack - Victoria, BC
said

Where can I get a job that has a pension plan that pays $70.00/hr wages and benefits.

Most pension plans that I have heard of pay 2% to a maximum 70% of your best 5 years

Sean Calder - Chatham ON
said

So the CAW is the one now dictating terms? What's good for GM has to be good for Chrysler...or what? Or ELSE?

Chrysler is a different organization. In "good times", as Ken Lewenza put it, patterned bargaining is tolerable because they can absorb the differences. In hard times when it's "do or die" what's good for one, may not be good for the other.

Ken Lewenza and the CAW do not have the authority to tell Chrysler that they have to accept the deal that GM did.

This is the arrogance and stupid stubbornness on the part of Union Executives that is killing the automotive industry.

Neil, Eastern township, qc
said

If Chryslers executives and the CAW are not willing to seriously team work and make major sacrifices, then i'm totally against giving any of my tax money.And if it closes down, they will only get what they deserve.

Doug BC
said

Well,I'm not one to advocate a race to the bottom when it comes to wages and benefits for workers in Canada.And I support most unions,most of the time.
However,militant unions cannot expect me to support wages and benfits that were obtained mainly though extortion and threats,than through real bargaining and real competition.If these people are really making $30 per hour,and have all those benefits too,I really think that is excessive for most assembley line workers.They have,in effect,managed to price themselves right out of the market.
I'm not totally against helping this industry to survive.I am,however,very much opposed to tax dollars being spent to save the jobs of the greedy,or those who use union membership as an excuse to be overpaid.
My thoughts go to the city of Winsor,it's citizens,and the impact this could have there.BUT,there is no way we can allow government to be "bullied" by any union,or it's workers.
If the union does step up and tries to be a reasonable part of the solution,we should try our best too.If not,I'd rather spend those finite tax dollars on people losing $12 per hour jobs.I doubt they have any money to put in savings,and I expect they work equally hard.
$30+ per hour,and all those benefits make auto workers a part of the fat cat crowd.Certainly no where close to "average" income families.It's just to bad they seem unable to realize that.

Rob
said

Why would you want to keep a company alive when their vehicles rank the lowest in all of the ratings.

14 out of 100, But please give us billions of your tax dollars!!!!!!

Thanks but no thanks!

Roger T
said

And why would any Canadian want to buy a Chrysler car after this stupid demand BLACKMAIL that they are putting to our Gov't and to us tax payers. Yes, it employess Canadians but ALL Canadians can send a strong message to Chrysler by bycotting their cars, MASS vs one car manufacture. There is already many choices so getting rid of Chrysler isn't a bad idea, one less competition.

Chrysler pls leave and we hope you the best in selling cars in a free fall US market.

Curtis from Kelowna
said

The world financial collapse is the best thing that happened to the world and it happened because it wasn't sustainable. If it was, it would still be here.

The auto industry was headed in the right direction with smaller vehicles and then the SUV race started. If they were building electric cars, charged with solar energy they wouldn't be in this position.

Everyone made money and GM invested their money, unions did well and now the party is over.

I don't want to pay for an overpriced vehicle to accommodate their bad business. Smaller companies are folding and this is no different. It is time to say good bye. It is nice for the auto workers to freeze their wages, it is time to drop them and get a grip on the reality of today.

WestJet is flourishing, is that smart business or what.

Big Burt
said

I am the furthest thing from a union supporter but what most everyone is missing is where the $70/HR figure comes from. For every current worker in a GM/Chrysler/Ford, there are 5-9 retired ones earning full pensions. I saw a presentation one time from the VP of HR at GM Canada who stated that they were paying benefits and pensions for over 300,000 GM retirees and workers (when the workers were under 25K).

The big problem here is that this pension plan is basically unfunded... and GM is paying as it goes. Toyota, Honda who haven't been making cars in North America for this long do not have this problem yet - and likely never will due to the fact that their employees don't have gold plated defined benefit pension plans. The big three clearly need to do something serious about this and it clearly can't happen solely on the back of the current workers (who take home something just north of $35/hr). I think they CAN reduce much more than the CAW just got from GM but to expect it can all come from the existing workers is not realistic.

The retiree's are going to have to give to the pot - which will hurt and will probably break some existing agreements. The big three also have to make some huge structural changes... otherwise we are just delaying the inevitable.

Ron in the West
said

To Tony Clement:

Please insist on much more major concessions from the CAW before you pump any taxpayer dollars into GM or Chrysler. The GM "deal" is still far too generous to the union (why do you think they voted almost 90% in favor when they never vote that high in favor of anything) and will do nothing to save the company. The Chrysler concessions by the CAW had better be much more steep than the GM concessions. Can't believe that GM proposed such an agreement, but when you think of it it is just this type of lousy "giving in" to unions that has got them into this mess in the first place. Wake up Tony and really hold their feet to the fire before any bailout is given. And please don't continue to call it a "loan". Loans demand repayment. Not likely to see any repayments from the auto sector. By the way, what concessions and/or sacrifices are the executive of the CAW making in all of this.

Sue M
said

I have owned Valiants, Caravans and a New Yorker.The vans were new the others used and I have to say I loved them and will be sad to see Chrysler go.However, I`m not impressed with the CAW and the union reps and don`t think that the general consensus among the autoworkers is to let Chrysler die in Canada. The Fat Cats are about to ruin it for everyone.

John , Oshawa
said

One of two things should happen. First, CTV to have a televised debate on this. Get people like Dennis Derosie and the CAW's economist together, among others and have a debate. Maybe then you people will see whos lieing to. If thats not good enough, sent the CAW a list of where all you union bashers work, and when our members stop buying things from your place of employment, the maybe you will see what happens to the economy without the auto workers. But I would really like to see the debate over boycot.

ben
said

It is time the auto workers themselves got with it - the good times are at an end and if they prefer living on EI instead of earning a wage of $50/hr there is something wrong with them. I'm sure there are thousands upon thousands of workers who would gladly work for $50/hr. The union executives need to give realistic and realize they may also not have their big paying jobs if Chrysler moves out of Canada.

JP in BC
said

LET them GO
and Chrysler- as you leave- take the Auto workers with you .
The tax payers of Canada are tired of hearing the Whining of these auto workers.
Maybe now they will have to find a real job and work for there money.
Unions have destroyed the working relationship between owner and worker.
To Unions - you have pushed and pushed - and what did you achive- nothing - its come back to Haunt you
Good diddens to Teh auto makers - let em all go back to USA
BUY FORGIEN - a Better product

Mag-toronto
said

Guys, listen to John from Chatham, he is telling the truth.

Randy
said

To "Jack from Windsor", I bet you are good at standing on the line. Let's see how smug you are when you are standing on the unemployment line.

Kim
said

According to Statistics Canada, direct labour costs make up only 7 percent of total vehicle production costs in Canada.
How important is the Auto Industry in Canada?
The Auto Industry is Canada's largest exporter, accounting for $70 billion, or 16% of the nation's total exports in 2007. Auto Industry exports are higher than those of the oil & gas industry, and more than double the level from each of the forestry, mining, metals and agriculture industries.
Auto workers pumped $8.8 billion into the Canadian economy in 2007 (24 million a day). Including spin-off jobs, the auto industry is responsible for more than 440,000 jobs across the country.
While I don't agree with Chrysler's stance in threatening to leave the country and blaming workers for their woes; I do think we need to see the big picture here. I hope all the naysayers towards the North American auto industry and auto workers don't live to eat their words!!!

Greg
said

Greg in Woodstock
As a toyota employee in woodstock I can tell everyone we make the same wages as the big three. Same benefits and same vacation. We do not make 70/hr just as the workers at the big three dont. The big difference is the big three have tens of thousands of retired workers while we have... ten maybe.

Bill
said

lasorda just proved to everyone that the CAW is not interested in helping. Pattern bargaining, the needs of Chrysler are different than Ford or GM. that goes for your neighbours. My household has different needs and requirements than my next door neighbour. The other thing I see is that for many years the CAW held a gun to the Big 3 in forms of strikes, now that the shoe is on the other foot, it sucks,eh.

Sally Canuck
said

You know what, I don't think this is an issue with the unions, and typically, I'm not very pro-union.

This stems to a deeper issue with American auto manufacturers and their leadership. They are practicing business the same way that they did decades ago, and that is just not viable anymore.

I'm also tired of people saying "support American auto companies", and criticizing my choice to buy a Honda. Many people are misinformed about where things are made. I'm proud to say that mine was made right here in Ontario. People need to realize that these "foreign" automakers, such as Toyota and Honda actually have large manufacturing facilities here in Canada. They employ a contingent of thousands in SW Ontario alone. They also have a better way of running their business, and more award-winning vehicles.

So if you ask me, I'm more justified in supporting Honda and their business practices and Canadian sites than the antiquated practices of GM or Chrysler.

Alberta Les
said

Let them go...no one else gets a big bail out then starts demanding more..time they went broke and learned their lesson.

BentPedals.
said

Just like Texas Hold'em . . . the auto makers are not in trouble. They are in a cyclical slump that comes along every 7-10 years and they've decided to play it to the hilt. New paint shop, new tech center in Oshawa, new overpasses from the 401 in Oshawa, all paid for by GM, to allow quicker accress to just in time delivery. In about a year these auto plants will be back to running three shifts 6 days a week. I'll bet my pension on it. He who blinks first loses.

Retired Taxpayer in Burlington
said

Do not give Chrysler one red cent. Begging for money and then making a threat to leave Canada if they don't get it.Let them pullout, I'm sure when the dust settles and the ecnomy starts to pick up there should be jobs available at the Honda and Toyota plants.Stop giving away taxpayers money, where does it all end.

Damian (GTA)
said

They are making a product no one wants, and want tax money to allow them to keep making a product which no one wants. So, the tax money bailout is really a taxpayer funded program to keep execs and the union labor employed.

If no one wants to buy your product, you shut down. If/when the demand goes up again, you re-open. What's the point of making cars no one will buy, either now, or in 2-3 years (when people will want to buy NEW cars, made then)???

BentPedals
said

Anyone recall about a year back when GM was very close to buying out Chrysler? There are machinations going on behind the scenes we'll never hear about. Ford doesn't need buyouts, GM might, Chrysler needs twice as much twice as fast. Damn, they've covered all the bases. Almost like they were in cahoots.

Bill
said

So what do CAW workers get?
80 PAA hours= 10 sick days
2 SPA weeks paid
4 - 4 day weekends
Christmas-New years off.
$1700 Christmas Bonus
and here is the kicker to all you poor saps out there. When you collect EI thats all you get, when an Auto workers collect EI he also gets another check from the Auto company for about $300.

kate
said

Hey Ken: the UAW is going to ratify deeper concessions than you clowns including a pay cut - not a freeze, a CUT. Do you really think that American taxpayers are going to approve of jobs here over US jobs? Really think they're going to pay your stupid demands when they can move it all to South America? The fact they haven't taken money from Canada yet and are planning to invest and expand in Brazil et al should be lighting a fire under your butt...can't get through all that lard I suppose.

Ya, it's all the unions fault!
said

And the hypocrite of the year award 2009 goes to Tom Lasorda. ( I know its only March but I doubt anyone can top him).

Former Chrysler CEO Tom LaSorda, now co-president and vice chairman, received a $15.7-million bonus from Daimler for helping with the sale of Chrysler to Cerberus. Reported earlier, LaSorda received a total of $20.7 million in total 2007 compensation.

Bob in Harley
said

At least Lasorda had the brains and intestinal fortitude to tell it as it is. G M and their non decision and lack of conviction once again shows why they are in trouble. Anyone with half a brain would realize you cannot compete with other manufacturers who have lower wage rates. As far as Lewenza is concerned his bunch are a big part of where the industry is today....nearly non existent as more and more buy other brands which by the way I do and which are made in Canada. Honda and Toyota are good examples. I hope our politicians do the right thing and insure that the big poker game with our money does not cost us money for a losing propositon.

M. Cameron
said

The CAW needs to make some serious concessions or risk losing many more jobs as the businesses to which their members work for will just go under.

Tax Payer
said

Down with all unions! They can't afford to survive in our newly evolving market! Do you think China has unions.

erin, edmonton
said

I have driven Chryslers my whole life and last week I did the unthinkable! I bought a Kia! Don't let the door hit you on your way out LaSorda!!

Mar
said

To Sally Canuck:
While your Honda may be made in Ontario, the profits all go back to Japan, they do not stay in Canada. And yes, there are many workers of foreign automakers in Canada, but do you think that would continue if they weren't competing in price with the North American manufacturers? I doubt they would stay here if the Big 3 all went under when they can instead take all work and profits back home and charge us whatever they want in shipping since we have no other option. And by the way, GM and Ford win many many awards for things ranging from fuel efficiency to overall worth of the vehicle, it is a myth that only the foreign cars win awards. The Big 3 obviously make cars people want to buy, otherwise, why would they sell millions of cars every year? And if SUVs etc were so awful and everyone seems to blame the Big 3 for them, why do so many people buy them, and why did Honda, Volkswagen, Suzuki and Toyota all start making their own versions??? Because there is demand for them, and they are also no longer the gas guzzlers everyone imagines them to be. Oh, and GM, Ford win awards for them, and their small cars etc. Please stop spreading the myth about Asian cars being better, they are all the same nowadays, depends on preference. So pick your preference, but supporting the auto industry staying in North America is something we all should do, whatever car you drive, or we will all regret the mass increase in the price of foreign cars and massive influx of unemployed people relying on EI.

The cost of labor is seven percent
said

of the cost of making a car.

The workers are not the problem.

Bad management is the problem.

Less financial finagling is what is needed.

Retired Soldier in Kingston, ON
said

Memo to Ken Lewenza, CAW Rep and Tom LaSorda, President of Chrysler Corp:

(1)Ken & the CAW: its better to have 45% deducted off your current wages then 100% of no job;

(2)Members of the CAW are living in a fantasy world. Chinese auto workers can knock off an exact replica of a Jeep "Cherokee" for about $11000 US+/- and the high-quality cars are assembled by hand by bona-fide engineers. That's right...by hand!!

(3)Tom: don't assume that the Canadian taxpayer is a chump or that the Ggovernment of Canada and the Minister responsible for this file are pushovers ! Your demands smack of incredible arrogance, stupidity, desperation or all of the above!!

(4) Minister of Industry: taxpayers, as you know are already ridiculously over-taxed and I'll be damned if my wife, who makes $11.14 per Hr will subsidize the CAW's extravagant lifestyles
and $100000 per year wages with overtime! Oh, the readers did'nt know about that small detail eh!!

Welcome to the real world Ken & Tom. Suck a lemon!!!

Pro Patria

steve
said

To CAW .... Do not back down. In fact why don't you ask for 25% increase in wages and benefits plus an additional week of spa days. Give the union members 50% new car rebate and pay for their mortgages. Pay for their kids eduction and the in-laws dentures. Make sure laid off workers get 100% of normal pay. CAW must stand for its members eventhough it means losing all jobs. The members will understanbd and they will not file a class action suite against the union. That should show the the automakers how tough we are.

Marla,Eastern Townships, Qc
said

I believe that concessions should be made, wether it be expense accounts eliminated for certain employees, or bonus cuts on the part of management. Either way it is beginning to get discouraging for the average working person who makes approximately $12/hr to hear that he may have extra taxes to pay for a bail-out..Inflation is already taken a bit bite out of the income that is left to take care of the essential expenses that occur in his/her everyday life without being expected to fall suit with whatever Ottawa decides is best...My question is ''where will it all end??''

Dave in Vancouver
said

The union leadership are looking at this the same way they look at all their other negotiations. They think that what's good enough for GM should be good enough for Chrysler.

Wake up Mr. Lewenza. If you want to do what's best for your union membership, you better swallow some pride and negotiate in an effort to save those jobs. Not only the CAW jobs, but also all of the jobs that will be lost with Chrysler suppliers.
The day of negotiating the best agreement with one company and forcing it on the other companies is over!

T-D Banks says economy in bad shape for next 5 yrs
said

Business people should start cutting their prices if they want to deal with me.

Dunny from Manotick
said

Right now, as in today, Chrysler Corp. is selling more vehicles in Canada than GM, Toyota, Ford or Honda. In fact they are the number one choice for new car buyers. Sure sales are down for everyone but things are less bad at Chrysler than one would be led to believe. This whole slump is starting to blow over. Restez calm.

Db Niagara Falls
said

Remember the Rae days. Please bring them back. The CAW has to understand take a pay cut for a predetermined amount of time or lose your jobs. I will vote against any politician that bails out the CAW.

Keith in Brampton
said

FOOLS!!!

Analysts have already said the deal struck with GM is too little; that 20% was really needed.

Now Chrysler asks for 20%, and the union just sputters about pattern bargaining.

Here's the thing: If you REALLY want to save Chrysler and GM - AND YOUR JOBS - take the full 20% ding to your paycheques.

Better 80% pay than 0%...

jeff from london
said

I say stick to your guns CAW... 70hr is VERY misleading. that includes retired employees costs and cost of benefits etc.. subtract the retires and your down to around 45 hr... most in ontario make around 28-30 with benefits included. Chysler is using this as an excuse to leave. If they really want to.. i for one will never buy a chrysler product again. I worked for a chrysler suplier and i know that the auto industry is crappy hours, but pays well. people sacrifice thier lives and years of family time for the scraps that they get... if they move, lets see what happens to thier sales.

Ruth
said

I can see it being $70.00 an hour. Not the wages the CAW take home, but the cost to the company, of benefits, payroll taxes, wcb, vacation pay, pension.

It is time the union gave some concessions, and a wage cut is needed. The deal they made with GM was a joke! If they really want to keep their jobs, take a wage cut.

Tony_Halifax
said

Go ahead, leave Canada, but take all your crappy cars with you.

Keith in Brampton
said

To Mar:

"While your Honda may be made in Ontario, the profits all go back to Japan, they do not stay in Canada." -- And Detroit three profits go...?? As far as Canada is concerned, we have no "Domestic" industry.

Re "Please stop spreading the myth about Asian cars being better": please pick up a copy of the Consumer Reports annual car issue (just out). Ford quality is improving and catching up to the Asians, but GM isn't - and Chrysler is actually getting worse. So who is spreading myths?

Don in NB
said

In my opinion, The back taxes Crysler owes our gov't should be deducted from the bailout figure. Then we start negoiting from there. Retired employees should be garanteed or deducted from the bailout. Workers over lets say 40 should have there pension money garranteed and deducted from the bailout and setup in a gov't account. The Average Canadian tax payer should't be left with the tab. These are all and will be Crysler expenses in the future if there still around. Then let's start these talks again and talk turkey.

Avi Ickovich
said

Why bail out carmakers?

A little known fact is that General Motors early in the 20th century bought lock, stock and barrel a functioning street car and tram service in Los Angeles only to let this infrastructure sit and be sold for scrap metal.

Their intent, of course, was to create demand for their product. Their chairman during the subsequent 20 years coined the phrase, “what is good for GM is good for the U.S. economy.” This statement was true to a certain extent in the early 1950s but certainly is not true today.

Both our current dependence on oil from unstable foreign governments and unsustainable urban sprawl are based on the creation of the automobile culture.

We need to return to urban planning that entails more compact communities and reverse the situation where the automobile is required for performing even basic errands or commercial activities.

Moreover, by decreasing personal automobile usage the trucking sector can utilize existing road infrastructure more efficiently.

So if we are trying to promote environmental protection, urban densification and increase transit usage, why would any government bailout the source of inefficient transportation choices?

The answer is simple, votes in Detroit, Dayton, Windsor, Oshawa, Ajax and so on.

President-elect Barack Obama has promised more environmental friendly transportation investments, but may relent to the employment impacts of letting the Big Three collapse. Fortunately, our government is a little more cautious and will only provide a limited bailout with a detailed business plan.

We should hope our respective governments let the inefficient segments of the auto industry collapse.

Bob in Woodstock
said

Greg in Woodstock: Thank you. I believe you are the first Toyota factory worker to speak up. So many of these clods complaining about the $70/hr simply cannot read. As you stated, there are NO hourly workers on the assembly line of ANY auto manufacturer making more than $34/hr.

Barney In Trenton
said

Give me a break,the autoworkers do NOT make $70. an hour.I have friends and relatives that work at GM and Chrysler and none of them make that.Some goofy auto analyst trying to justify his job sugar coated that to come up with that amount. And the people that are complaining about the wages the CAW workers get... YOU should have applied for the job,no one told you to stay in the crappy job that you keep complaining about.

Dylan in BC
said

I don't think any of these car companies should be getting tax dollars. All I see on TV is car commercial after car commercial. We're essentially subsidizing television stations and advertising executives. It's rubbish.

Ted
said

The time of unions is over. Give a little or loose alot. Time for us all to consider where we are headed. However, if the little guy has to suffer a loss, then the the big guys need to pay more to the economy. If labour costs to build a car are going to go down, then too should the cost of a car.

Leo
said

I totally agree with David From Windsor
"A blow like this would cripple Windsor for longer than I would even like to imagine. Many people will comment and say that it's just a bunch of overpaid union workers that have it too good. It is that narrow minded thinking that is hurting everyone involved and even the people that are indirectly involved. The ripple effect would go further than anyone really understands or wants to even imagine. I would never wish for so many families to lose their jobs (I think the individuals that do want Chrysler to fall are very sick for wanting that) and I hope that Mr. Clement & Mr. Harper know that they should choose their words wisely over the next few days. It could make the difference of how Ontario votes next time around."

Karla
said

So, let's see..at 70.00 an hour..if the average worker works an 8 hour day, 50 weeks a year (like most of the general population, 2 weeks off)..that is a salary of 140,000 a year. There are many families with dual incomes that don't make that together in a year. Take the pay cut, save your jobs. Look back at what Gainers did in Edmonton in 1997. The union wouldn't concede and they closed down, with hundreds out of work. So you'll make 100,000 instead..at least you will still have your jobs. That's what the union should be negotiating..the guarantee of these jobs with the cut in pay..I would rather see 10,000 people still working and maybe having to make some financial concessions than 10,000 on the unemployment line.

Cambob
said

A $32,000 MSRP Chrysler car is:
$17,000 Materials & Operations
$2,000 Marketing
$6,000 Labour
$7,000 Profit

Is labour the problem?
Is profit margin the problem?
NEITHER!

Tax:
$1,600 GST
$2,560 PST (Ontario)
$1,200 Destination & freight
$75.00 Licence fee (Province)
$60.00 Licence fee (Toronto)
Insurance: (Mandatory Law)
$3,000 Yearly

So after you buy the vehicle, you pay the government $8495.00.
Not including gas tax, tire tax, tax tax, etc...

Face it folks, the union, the management are not the real monsters. The people you elected all these years have been squandering your money every day. Liberal, Conservative, doesn't matter.
They take 30% of your earnings. Then 30% more of anything you buy.

D'oh Canada!

andrew
said

leave it to the CAW.... greed is what caused the problems... greed will also finish chrysler... then all of the pensions are gone as well as all of the jobs. They will have the CAW to thank for it!!!

L Greg C
said

Lets see, Chrysler is saying give us money or we go. Lets remember something when Mercedes sold Chrysler to Cerberus Capital Management. The word on the street was that Cerberus would start to sell off Chrysler bit by bit, did they not try to sell the Viber line just over a year ago. Also stop trying to put the blame on the auto-worker, if your boss gave you the kitchen-sink you would take it. Put the blame where is should go on the Head of the CAW and the management of the Big Three. Also as I said Cerberus well sell Chrysler, they just need time, because right now Cerberus know they would not get what they paid for it, but in time who knows. So I say let them go or should I say go to hell Cerberus.

Jay in Onatrio
said

I owned nothing but Chrysler minivans for years for my business - best on the road by far, and lasted me forever with little or no problems. But when my business started going under, the government didn't give me a bailout, in fact, they did the opposite.

I don't care if they're the best or the worst run company, everyone just keeps running to the government (and us poor taxpayers) for a handout. I quit smoking, but the tobacco farmers still wanted my money because it hurt their bottom line. Where is the justice?

I do feel bad for anyone losing their job. But the writing has been on the wall for the unions, and the big-wig union goons are too stubborn and out of touch to realize that it's 25%, or 100%. The company owes you nothing beyond your paycheque, just the same as you owe them nothing but your 100% effort when you walk in the door. But you must work together, or they'll be out of business, and you'll be out of work.

I wish the workers well, but stubbornness is very rarely overcome with common sense.

Brian from Barrie
said

The union better wake up and smell the roses. The recent "cuts" by the GM workers were not cuts at all. It was a joke. All the people that have commented that the average auto worker does not make $70 an hour are mistaken. That takes into account hourly wage, benefits, holidays, retirement package etc. They had better realize that they HAVE to give up some of their perks or lose their jobs outright. Why does the companies pay legal fees for divorce and home closings? Why does the auto worker not contribute to their own pension plan? Come on, get with the times!

Murad
said

Here's hoping that Ken Lewenza is as dumb as his predecessor. Let the CAW hold out for their over-inflated wages and spa days. Hopefully, Chrysler will bail out of Canada, so we don't have to listen to them whine about how they deserve this and that. Then the autoworkers in Windsor will actually have to get off their lazy spoiled $70/hr duffs and get real jobs for normal wages. Maybe Ken Lewenza can pay you $70/hr to clean his pool.

Rick Greensides
said

Let Chrysler go!!!
All big businesses want their workforce to work for peanuts," or they threaten to move the plant to Mexico or some other third world country.How can you compete with a dollar or two an hour in these other countries? This drop in the Canadian standard of living has to stop somewhere.Bring back ALL of of our manufacturing jobs to the USA and Canada!!!

Rick Greensides
Thorold,Ontario

barry
said

i just see on the news the bashing of workers again,,,,why is it not known how much the none caw peaple are costing the big 3 a year????? maybe the peaple need to know...... when are the news peaple going to get all the fax before passing judjment??????????

Des From the Peg
said

Finally....A Car company executive with the balls to tell the CAW....THIS IS HOW WE ARE GOING TO MANAGE THE BUSINESS. It is too bad this did not happen a long time ago. The North American 3 may be in much better shape if they did.

robert ashton nanaimo b.c.
said

why are we as canadians bailing out american company's? why dont we spend the money we are giving the americans and build our own cars?I have a hard time tring to figure out why canadian tax payers are bailing out american car company's

Bob in Woodstock
said

Karla
So, let's see..at 70.00 an hour..

Oh come on, people. Surely you can't all be this dense as to think auto workers actually earn $70/hour. Read the story again....and again if you need to.

The $70/hr includes the hourly wages, benefits, government deductions, retiree costs, managment & so on, all divided by the number of current active workers on the line. It's a screwed up skewed number that was created to make the workers look bad.

Learn the facts before you start spewing this crap.

bill from edmonton
said

Don't let them go until they pay back the taxes they owe along with all the penalties, seize all the assets they have here to help out all the loyal employees they are abandoning, and then, escort them to the border!!

Will
said

I still remember when Lee Iacoca was the CEO of Chrysler in the Usa and his company was facing bankrupcy and he ran to the federal government for a bailout and demanded his unionized workers take a paycut for 3 years in keeping the company alive and when the union workers said yes to save their jobs Mr Iacoca imeeditaely gave himself a raise of 1 million dollars .. To make matters worse when the 3 year term was over he made his workers walk off the job after invoking strike action against Chrysler.. I don't think the workers should fall into the same sob story this Lasorda is demanding from his workers.. Let the CAW call his bluff.They negotiated a pretty good settlement at GM why is Chrysler now balking unfair..

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