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Parliament votes down Bloc budget amendments
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CTV.ca News
Date: Thu. Jan. 29 2009 7:34 PM ET
The Conservative budget cleared its first hurdle Thursday evening as Parliament rejected a Bloc Quebecois amendment to extend EI eligibility and lend more support to the forestry and manufacturing sectors.
The Bloc amendment also aimed to derail a pan-Canadian securities commission and accused the Tories of giving tax cuts to the wealthy.
But only the Bloc and the NDP voted in favour of the changes, which would have eliminated contentious tax cuts for middle-class Canadians.
The Bloc amendment also included a section to "maintain the right of women to settle pay equity issues in court," which became a hot-button issue during the Conservatives' fiscal fall update as the opposition accused the Tories of attacking women's rights.
The Bloc amendment vote comes four days before the House votes on Liberal additions to the budget.
Meanwhile, Grit Leader Michael Ignatieff announced Wednesday that his party would support the Tory budget -- for a price.
Grits to support budget
The hitch, Ignatieff said, was that the Conservatives would be required to provide three updates over the next year on the economy and the implementation of the budget.
The amendment, requiring reports in March, June and December, will go to a vote on Monday and is expected to pass.
Meanwhile, the New Democrats have produced a series of scathing radio ads that blast Ignatieff for propping up the Conservatives.
The NDP and Liberals had earlier formed a coalition, with the support of the Bloc Quebecois, to bring down the government -- a plan Ignatieff has since backed away from.
The ads claim Ignatieff has failed his first major test as a leader, proving NDP Leader Jack Layton is the only one willing to take a stand against Harper.
"The simple message they want to get out is if you don't like Stephen Harper look to the NDP. The Liberals aren't the party you should be looking to, they're clones of the Tories so vote NDP," said CTV's Roger Smith.
Liberal gains in Quebec
Earlier Thursday, a new poll showed the Liberals establishing a strong lead over the Conservatives in Quebec, and even challenging the Bloc Quebecois in the all important province.
The CROP poll published in La Press shows the Liberals with 31 per cent support in the province, creeping up on the separatists' 34 per cent and leaving the Conservatives behind with just 16 per cent support.
"This is terrible news for the Conservatives," said CTV's Ottawa Bureau Chief Robert Fife. "As Brian Mulroney used to say, you cannot win a majority government in this country without Quebec."
On the other hand, the numbers are great news for Ignatieff.
He's looking strong just one day after putting his amendment on the Conservatives' federal budget, and seems to be gaining popularity in Quebec, where he has a good relationship with Liberal Premier Jean Charest.
He suggested the shift in strength is a result of Harper's misjudgement during the last election, and Ignatieff's effective maneuvering in the province.
"This bodes very well for the Liberal party in Quebec," Fife said.
However, he pointed out that if the Liberals continue to pose a serious threat to the Bloc, it's possible that leader Gilles Duceppe will shift his support to the government.
Budget amendment
Earlier Thursday, Industry Minister Tony Clement said the Liberals' budget demands are reasonable.
"We had every intention of updating both Parliament and the Canadian people on our progress with respect to this budget," Clement said Thursday.
Ignatieff had said the budget was "flawed" because, among other things, it fails to extend EI eligibility, attaches strings to infrastructure dollars that may delay projects and jobs, and lacks a credible plan to get out of the deficit situation.
However, he said the budget includes important concessions such as affordable housing, skills development and measures to make credit available to businesses.
It also includes measures to provide a tax rebate to Canadians who undertake renovation projects.
Clement said that even by the time the government is required to deliver its first report in March -- in less than two months -- there will be progress to report.
Clement acknowledged, however, that some measures such as infrastructure spending, will take longer to implement and may not be in place by the first scheduled update.
"Rome wasn't built in a day nor will all of Canada's infrastructure be built in a day and I think Canadians will be realistic."
Meanwhile, Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Danny Williams launched a public relations campaign to stall budget changes that will alter equalization payments under the Atlantic Accord.
Williams has said that his province stands to lose $1.5 billion over three-years, and he petitioned Ignatieff to stand up against Harper over the changes.
"(Ignatieff) acknowledged there was a very serious problem," said Williams Thursday, adding that he has support of premiers from other Atlantic provinces.
With files from The Canadian Press
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I applaud the budget, even though Health Care and education may stay unscathed. Sadly this cannot last and I worry to later this year where cuts will become enviable. If anything, this provides the Wildrose Alliance plenty of ammo when an election is called.


Comments are now closed for this story
Gary Thunder
said
We are back to a dysfunctional Parliament for quite a long time, that should see the Conservatives rack up historical deficits, worse than Mulroney could ever do.
There is a group of Conservatives that are talking about splitting from Harpers dysfunction and forming their own Party. More power to them.
Biggest looser is Layton
said
I hope this continue, it is certainly in our best interest and Canada whould be the winner in all this.
See what collaboration can accomplish instead of that constant backstabbing.
At the end the biggest looser is Layton, he never was able to see the big picture. His own interest were more important to him than his electeors and his country!
Gary Thunder
said
Maybe his new plan is to prorogue the House of Commons permanently and just sit in his 'Kingdom' of appointed Senators.
Jim in Edmonton
said
Jackie Barrett
said
What I heard from Danny Williams' speech, if the budget is passed, Newfoundlanders could lose $1.5 billion over three years due to the new equalization and non renewable resource clawback mechanism. This would result in economic suicide for the hard working people of Newfoundland and Labrador.
Therefore, if Michael Ignatieff has any heart and decency whatsoever for all Canadians, he should do the right thing and add the 50% non renewable resource royalty clawback option so Newfoundlanders will not severely suffer from Harper's heartless policies against us.
That way, Ignatieff can sleep a little easier at night knowing that all Canadians are treated fairly and no province is forced into an economic suicide like Harper and Flaherty plan to vent on the Newfoundlanders.
George in Fredericton
said
He will blame the conservatives for all the negative fallout from the world economic situation and at the first opportunity he gets ; after he has built his party back to some sort of strength, he will bring the house down.
I find it interesting though, that he says on the air ," This document has no merrit and does not help the Canadian people who need it most" YET he supports it. What's up with that Iggy.
Under these circumstances NO government could function.
Please Mr. Ignatief, hurry up and bring this house to an end , so we the people can get rid of you.
We need a government with a solid footing to get a real stimulus going in this country.
tracy
said
Gary Thunder
said
The contractors that were working for cash will now require receipts and subsequently raise their prices. A tax grab, by any other name. And of course, expect the prices to go up at your local lumber yards.
BooBear in Cumberland
said
S. Miller
said
proud conservative
said
Michelle
said
NOW GET THE BUSES MOVING IN OTTAWA!!!!
DRH
said
Enjoy your summer...........in the EI line.
Gid'day
said
You are continuing to make the same media mistruths about PM
mulroony. When he came to power he had a budget deficit of $40 billion!! This was from the "great" Pierre Trudeau. In todays terms, this was a $60-70 billion.
I am no lover of those days, but lets keep the facts straight.
Spenc
said
Ed Ontario
said
Romes
said
Poor Farmer
said
Canadians, rich, middle class and poor alike want nothing more then to have partisan politics put to the side and for all sides of the house to work together, to get us through these rather tough economic times.
So far I like what I see in the budget, but Mr. Ignatieff is right about asking for an amendment in the current budget.
One thing that Harper or Flaherty has addressed is the EI benefit situation.
People who are now among the ranks of the unemployed are still waiting two weeks for a cheque and that's only if they qualify.
Something needs to be done about this ASAP for those Canadians from coast to coast to coast, who are losing their jobs and are finding that because of their geographic location, they're not qualified.
One individual waited a month, without a single penny, just to find out they don't qualify for EI.
Let's get on with the business of parliament and make these wrongs right and do whatever it takes to turn this economic ship in the right direction and stop bickering about your ridiculous ideaology.
I'm sure there are enough sensible people on that hill who can work together and let the best idea's surface.
Don Rodgirs
said
MDHinDC
said
Anthony
said
I will dare to make a prediction.. Neither one of them will ever be a Prime Minister.
Rob, Sackville, NB
said
What happened to that second amendment Iggy??
brenda
said
Helen L.M. Webster
said
Helen Webster
St. John's, NL
Gary Thunder
said
Initially, during that Press Conference, Ignatieff said there were TWO conditional amendments. The accountability amendment AND an amendment for access to EI.
What happened to that second amendment Iggy??
=============================
He needs the support of the Bloc and NDP. It is no longer there to make ammendments. The accountability issue is a joke and really makes the Liberals look like fools. Something tells me the "closet Conservative" John Manley wrote the speech.
Richard L. Provencher
said
Michael Scanlon-Newmarket
said
For the longest time we have needed a good balance in our federal government. The best of both worlds seems to be forming now. The Conservatives still have the ultimate control of things as long as they play nice with th Liberals and hand them a bone once and a while with their regular updates. Jack Layton and his puffed up chest can sit down and play the role he always has had in his career, a backbencher for life. No chance of being a power broker Jack, just sit back and collect your pay. The Bloc continues to blah, blah about Quebec and now has less power and influence than ever.
So as long as the Conservatives are in check from the Librals, I think we have a great opportunity to hhave a government that will do things the country needs to have done. FINALLY!
Barry Letang
said
Rather than accepting Obama’s impractical, asinine and socialistic assertion that “only the government can break the vicious cycles crippling the economy”, fiscal conservatives understand that a country can not spend its way out of a recession; and therefore, would do nothing more than facilitate the free market healing process. Fiscal conservatives recognize that if additional spending was the solution we, and especially the United States, wouldn’t be in this recession since comrades Bush and Harper’s governments spent much more than any preceding governments in history.
Conservatives appreciate that deficit spending that the government of the day is stealing money from our grandchildren and their grandchildren who will be inflicted with massive taxes to pay for today’s superfluous, colossal spending.
Genuine conservatives understand that assets sales plus cutting inefficient, profligate and peripheral billions from the $230 billion Federal budget and applying those resuscitate tax dollars to retroactively lower all levels of personal income taxes for 2008 and beyond, cutting payroll taxes, corporate taxes and capital gain taxes which would put dollars into the hands of people who would immediately spend it would accelerate the market place therapeutic process.
shelley
said
Gary
said
Don't take the West for Granted
said
It is starting to get real serious as money is lost every time we sell our animals. This trade issue is not in our hands and is hammering us.
The Conservatives are taking this Western Vote for granted. Big mistake.
A word of Caution to the Conservatives, as there are rumblings of town hall meetings to start a new right wing party again.The West no longer feels represented, as we are being overlooked so the big vote provinces come their way.
Diane
said
I can't believe that there are people on this website who think it is O.K for renovators to accept cash payment and evade paying taxes on income earned. Aside from being illegal it is immoral as well. Why should I pay taxes while others cheat? These guys doing this are also screwing themselves out of CPP in the long run. It shows you where these bloggers are coming from..the government is trying to flush out cheaters because renovations will have to be declared. I think its Great...make these cheaters pay their fair share of taxes finally. Whoever thought of this was brilliant!
armin
said
next how about that financial wizard paul martin? yes he managed to bring the federal budget under control, be offloading billions of dollars onto the provinces. surely we haven't forgotten the term "offloading" yet. wasn't he a liberal?
wasn't alan rock a liberal and didn't he flush damn near 2 billion into the tiolet with his pet project "the useless gun registry"?
i don't particularly favor one party over the other, as they appear to all be incompetent, however when i hear some morons bemoaning for the return of the liberals as a cure to all our probelms i want to hurl. as for our newfoundland cousins they should have displayed some backbone and told that idiot danny williams to pound sand. here's an interesting thought for NF/L. if the liberals are so great why don't you all remember that when it's provincial election time? toss that idiot out and maybe have a seat at a caucus table.
Inkmont
said
bunny
said
Chris Maxemuck
said
Prof. Pye Chartt
said
"Hey! Where's OUR money?! Where's MY money?!"
Sorry, folks. The federal budget stands as an economic stimulus measure; not a charitable handout.
Rob, Sackville, NB
said
"He needs the support of the Bloc and NDP. It is no longer there to make ammendments. The accountability issue is a joke and really makes the Liberals look like fools. Something tells me the "closet Conservative" John Manley wrote the speech."
------------------------------
I would bet you're right about Manley. I noticed he started campaigning for Harper's job late last year with that ridiculous G&M piece. I've just written Ignatieff and LeBlanc (my MP) as well as Yvon Godin (EI critic) and Libby Davies (NDP House Leader). The budget NEEDS that amendment. I hope someone introduces it.
J. Fletcher
said
Jim in Ontario
said
My questions are: when is the Liberal party going to have a democratic and open leadership contest for Mr Ignatieff given that the conditions for his APPOINTMENT by the party elite, no longer apply? Why did Ignatieff sign the coalition document in December? Was that signature in good faith, or was it simply a vehicle to circumvent democratic due process?
I'm watching you Iggy
said
Concerned Canadian
said
But we don't need an election- our current MP's can do the job. And had the NDP/Liberal coalition taken over, they would have had to produce another budget, taking more time and staling the recovery. No matter who is in power, we're going to have to go into deficit to get out of this mess. And with Ignatieff holding the government to account, at least we'll be able to keep an eye on Mr. Harper's Conservatives, who have broken promises and failed to deliver before.
Gary Thunder
said
Well, the budget has passed and the Headmaster will monitor the kids to make sure they keep their promises to be good.
I can't believe that there are people on this website who think it is O.K for renovators to accept cash payment and evade paying taxes on income earned. Aside from being illegal it is immoral as well. Why should I pay taxes while others cheat? These guys doing this are also screwing themselves out of CPP in the long run. It shows you where these bloggers are coming from..the government is trying to flush out cheaters because renovations will have to be declared. I think its Great...make these cheaters pay their fair share of taxes finally. Whoever thought of this was brilliant!
==================================
Can you spell I-N-F-L-A-T-I-O-N ???
Yeah, that is all we need on top of a recession. Now you know why Conservative policies don't work. They cannot see past their zelousness to the effects of what they propose!
James
said
Thousands more jobs lost here and there. These industries closing their doors. These provincial governments posting unheard of deficits. Canadian banks restricting lending because of record foreclosures and bankruptcies. The recovery from the "depression" will take much longer than expected.
The truth of the matter is that this financial crisis is gaining strength with no bottom in sight. Obama has stated that "we don't have a moment to lose." I think that Harper and his government is aware of this and that this week's budget is a bandaid on a shotgun wound. I think I am safe in saying that in 6 months time, July/Aug, the Canadian public and the world will have a clear picture of the incredible mess we're in. Then the governments of the world will finally come to the conclusion that the only way to recover from this is to forgive all debt. They'll have no choice because so many jobs will have been lost, debt will be in the hundreds of trillions of dollars world wide and the markets and banks will be gripped by paralysis as countries go bankrupt. Look at Iceland and Ireland and most eastern European countries and the Third World for examples.
Some think my idea of forgiving all debt is ludicrous. I simply say, learn from history. How did the Nazi grow? They grew because of the depression and people's willingness to believe that trying to enslave and murder others would bring them out of their despair.
I do not believe that another world war is the answer to this crisis. I would much rather see the greatest act of human forgiveness and compassion as the means to emerge from this "man" made disaster. It must be done!! FORGIVE ALL DEBT!!
Toronto Nick
said
Gord. Robson, Nova Scotia
said
This is the worst time to be PM, no matter what you put or do not put in the BUDGET you are DAMNED by the MEDIA and the general population.
The G.G. made it clear that the LEADER of the COALITION had to be in for TWO YEARS.
Ignatieff DOES NOT want to share POWER with LAYTON for any TWO years!
He is interim Liberal leader until the leadership convention in May.
Some time after May he will topple the Conservative Government.
It is much easier to sit in opposition and PLAY TOUGH GUY and THREATHEN than be a hard working PM.
This "TOUGH GUY APPROACH" is turning many Canadians OFF.
UNDER the circumstances Prime Minister Harper is doing a GREAT JOB in a no win
situation.
jeanken@sympatico.ca
said
If the younger generation get hit with some of this debt, we must remember that a lot of it is infrastructure and that they would have had to pay anyway to upgrade later. Also keep in mind that after 2011 the war costs will not be there and that money can be spent to decrease the debt as well.
The entire world is going through tough times at the moment and the governments cannot do everything for the individuals affected. They can only do what they deem best, but no matter what they do there will always be complainers. As far as The NDP and Mr. Layton are concerned they obviously only wanted power. And the Liberals will wait until an election so they can blame the Cons for all the ills to get into power. How naive some of the voters are to the trickery of politicians.
Those of us who were around for the Trudeau years know all too well what trickery the Libs use, and the debt that was incurred. I wish all politicians could be honest and forthright to the people, instead of using games in parliament to achieve their own desires for power.
Sara in Sask.
said
It is directly related to a 75 billion dollar bank bailout program for Canada's chartered banks, announced, virtually unnoticed, four days before the October Federal election.
The bank bailout received close to no media coverage; its budgetary implications were not analyzed. The $700
billion US bank bailout under the Troubled Assets Relief Program, was the object of debate and legislation in the US Congress.
In contrast, in Canada, the granting of 75 billion dollars to Canada's chartered banks was implemented at the height of an election campaign, without duly informing the Canadian public.
This is the most serious public debt crisis in Canadian history.
Read the whole story at globalresearch.ca
captbob
said
I know that the economic climate is very challenging, and that something needed to be done. I would rather it be done by a Harper government than a Liberal or coalition government. I know the political gun which was held to Harpers head. And infrastructure spending is tolerable- it is an investment of sorts into our society.
But I hate the idea of shafting my children.
I have four of them, and I have saved and worked to give them a good life. We all do that. We nurture and seek to guide our children. We lay up funds for education. What we don’t do is rack up the credit card debt and them hand them the bill.
But politically, we overthrow these concepts. We will do everything not to have our standards of living lowered, and are perfectly willing to pass the bill to our children. Shame on us.
And make no mistake about it: deficit spending is adding to our debit which will require the taxes of my children to pay off. We are giving them the bill for our problems. Why do we do this? Why are we entitled to pass the bill to the generation(s) behind us- something we would not think of doing on a personal level?
What will we say to them when they ask us, with incredulity: You spent our money on what? I am embarrassed at what we are doing.
Here are a few titbits reflecting the budgets provisions- new spending on top of already generous government programs:
$1 billion for "green" infrastructure, and $1 billion for clean-energy research.
We are doing enough on this front.
* $1.5 billion for job training
I can buy the need for this.
* $7.8 billion for social housing and home renovation, including a one-year only Home Renovation Tax Credit of up to $1,350 per household.
Why should the government subsidise my home renovations?
* $2.7 billion in short-term loans to the auto industry.
Loans? I don’t believe that. This on top of all kinds of largess for various industries.
* More than $1.4 billion for aboriginal schools, health, water, housing, community services and training.
When do we say enough?
We must cut our spending habits, reduce the size of government, and leave a legacy our children can manage. This budget does none of this.
Mike in Mississauga
said
Elizabeth M.
said
The equalization formula was broken; that is why it had to be changed. Why on earth should the rest of Canada continue to give money to your province when you are making more money than most? Do you honestly think it is fair that Ontarians or British Columbians (for example) continue to pay your province money when you are making a killing with oil? Because it is a non-renewable resource? Notice that Ontario is now learning that automobiles are also not a renewable source of income(guaranteed, anyway). Your province has been allowed to collect money in a way similar to those who cheat taxes: don't claim all of your income and you will get a huge refund. THAT is why the formula had to change. Quit soaking the rest of the country, please.
Niagara George
said
Their first two years were filled with phony announcements that never materialized. Hopefully, these progress updates will prevent that from happening again.
Gabe
said
COALITION
The coalition was a viable option in December, after over a year of Harper playing bully on the opposition parties. That moment has passed and has been rectified due to Minister Flaherty creating a budget that incorporates ideals from the opposition parties.
BUDGET
The budget is sound - not perfect, but sound. Ignatieff is not "propping up" the Conservative government: he is helping to create an accountable and forward-thinking government.
All of you who are whining about Layton, Ignatieff, and Harper should be ashamed, as this is EXACTLY how a minority government is supposed to work!
Those of you complaining that Ignatieff has no right to propose amendments or demand changes "because he is not the leader of the country" are just silly!!! That is exactly his right (and his responsibility).
Let's see how this goes, people. Give it time to evolve. I think we will see a new, more co-operative Conservative government, as opposed to the harsh "governing by the stick" approach it was using prior to their close-call in December.
And, finally, let's not forget that we have it really good here in Canada, by and large, compared with many other countries. At least it is money where our biggest concerns lie, and not safety and war.
O Canada!
Chris in Ontariariari-Oh!
said
Bob,Calgary,Alberta
said
Kevin in Toronto
said
The government purchased assets - such as guaranteed mortgages to free up liquidity within the banks. This frees up money previously tied up in waiting for mortgage payments, making it easier for the banks to loan out money.
In the end, the government will make a modest return on this investment.
A bailout is simply handing out money. This was a purchase of assets and more like an investment.
Edward Loder
said
M M B Ont
said
Anyone claiming that Harper and the Conservatives have spent foolishly nneds to research their info and look back at the Liberal years. Many have already pointed out the foolish spending of the Liberals under Chretian, the leaky subs, Adscam, Gun registry, robbing the EI fund and many more. Add to that , Paul Martin and Chretian changed the EI so that many now do not even qualify to receive it and Martin dropped the rate to 55% of your wages. I would love to see Martin or any Politician try to live on 55% of his earnings. Shame on the Liberals.
Now it's time to give the Conservatives a shot at leading this country the way they were recently elected to do. For Iggy to even say if the reports in Mar are not favorable he will take over is ridiculous. Nothing gets accomplished overnight... especially in gov't. He is showing true arrogance and thinks he is the PM.
Red X
said
You have 1 month to buy RRSPs to save 15% in taxes. At the point you receive your tax return you can set up a TFSA during the year till Dec. 31. save $40 something bucks on a 3-4% rate of return.
Tono
said
Diane
said
Anybody who runs a business also knows how to spell the word COMPETITION.
This usually makes business charge a fair price for a job, and pay their taxes rather than cheating all of the other tax payers out their fare share of taxes. Worse still, the honest people have to pay more.
Tommy - Toronto
said
Harper is just another Socialist. Reform is dead.
said
Ontario says thanks for the loot, Harper.
said
In his first public statement on Tuesday's Conservative budget, the Liberal McGuinty crowed that it was a victory for his four-year-old "fairness" crusade for Ontario.
While provincial officials were still crunching the numbers last night, early Ministry of Finance projections estimate the federal stimulus package could inject between $17 billion and $19 billion into the Ontario economy over the next two years.
John E
said
KW
said
If any of these "leaders" were actually listening to Canadians, they would realize that we are fed up of the games.
Do your jobs and get this country back on track.
From the East
said
"...or was it simply a vehicle to circumvent democratic due process?"
Sorry to dissillusion you, but under the British Parlimentary system, this is democratic due process.
BC Voice of Reason
said
The crisis inducing unemployment rate of December 2009 is 6.6%
John form ONtario
said
Gail (Hamilton)
said
John K
said
When those new seats get added to Alberta, B.C., and Ontario (mostly in the suburbs and small towns), Quebec's importance and relevance in federal politics will be greatly reduced.
Upset Conservative!
said
Am I the only person who feels this way?
Lib fan
said
I think its time to stop playing games in Parliament and get working. The economic crisis is worsenng and more and more jobs are being lost. HELLO!!!!!!!to those MPs who are still trying to bash and grab power; Canadians are in need of help. I really don't care who has power in the government as long as they do their jobs.
Gary Thunder
said
Now this will be interesting?? Won't it??
The quickest way for the Bloc to destroy Canada would be to prop up Harper.
Scott in Halifax
said
Wes
said
Time to balance the House of Commons.
Lib fan
said
Mark _____ Petawawa
said
Abdula from Ottawa
said
I would rather a cooperative government as we seem to be getting than a autocratic one which Mr Harper tried to do and failed. It is his own fault that he now has to go hat in hand to the liberals every time he wants to pass something. How is this the "the best prime minister this country has ever had?"
Steve in PEI
said
I got mad at him for the flag thing, but I forgave him for that after a lot of things he did right... he stood up to celebrity idiots Paul McCartney and Heather Mills on CNN over the seal hunt, he forced the oil companies to accept Newfoundland's terms to take Newfoundland's irreplaceable resources over Hebron, and he told Abitibi-Bowater to shove it. Central Canadians think that when companies tell Newfoundland to spread her legs, the only answer should be "how wide." Danny Williams has stood up for Newfoundland. No More Giveaways! Newfoundland's resources are precious and for the most part irreplaceable. If Newfoundlanders don't benefit sufficiently let it all rot in the ground.
Newfoundlanders are anything but sheep politically but there's a reason why this government has so much influence. The provincial Tories are going nowhere soon. And Harper will play nice because Williams has proven his influence and Harper can't afford to take even a single seat for granted. He needs to improve his relationship with Williams to be more competitive in Newfoundland in the next election. Williams may be flamboyant, but if you think he's stupid, it only proves you don't know what you're talking about.
Mary in Calgary
said
Brian in Edmonton
said
I find it hard to believe any party could table a budget right now without running a massive deficit.
Like it or not, Ignatieff had little choice but to support this budget and his amendment is well intentioned. We need to ensure the budget issued are being implemented in as timely a fashion as possible and are producing maximum economic stimulus.
The Liberals know that bringing down the government and facing a possible election would be political suicide as the Liberals have no funds to run an effective election campaign at this time.
All parties need to work together and face these serious issues head on for the betterment of all Canadians.
They now say the Liberals are gaining support in Quebec....somehow I find that a little hard to believe.
Harper is now truly in the drivers as the other parties have all crossed political boundaries with their coalition threat that they will have to answer for come election time.
edCP
said
John from Fredericton
said
I'm a Liberal and I can say that the same conservative approach to a budget would have devastating consequences on our economy. Just look what a conservative approach did to the United States.
I look froward to you small c conservatives voting ABC next election.
Peter Rapsey
said
Mr. Harper...play nice if you can.
Dave in Courtenay
said
Cambob
said
Stephen Harper called an election while the economy was still in good shape, but half way through everything started to crash. He has changed his tune remarkably from September through to January.
Two men of principal and ambition. Both with a set of values.
One of them abandons democracy and takes over his party then tosses his 'coalition allies' to the dogs.
The other changes his stand on economics to reflect the risk of losing control of parliament to an fundamentally risky coalition. (and also to reflect the rapidly changing economy) Then he comprimises his core beliefs and delivers a budget busrting with spending which many economists and the general public agree is a good budget for these difficult times.
These are the two men who will ask for you vote in the Summer '09 election.
Choose wisely.
Jay, Ottawa
said
I've been waiting for this to happen for a while now. You can't rule, you must lead, if you want to keep people happy. Maybe it'll be the return of the Progressive Conservatives.
Keith in Brampton
said
They wouldn't allow Harper to play dirty politics with THEIR funding, but now has no problem when Harper decides to take revenge against provinces who failed to support him?
I guess some Canadians are more important than others...
Brian - Winnipeg
said
Maureen
said
Chris in Ontariariari-Oh!
said
Concerned Canadian
said
I think you've expressed the disappointment of many Canadians who thought that the Conservatives might be more fiscally responsible than the Liberals, just as many people were disappointed in the States when the Republicans turned out to be even bigger spenders than the Democrats.
What this tells us, I think, is not that Mr. Harper is a hypocrite (although that may be true - look how he lied about the fixed election dates and not appointing people to the Senate), but that no matter which party is in power, there are certain economic realities that neither party can be held accountable for.
It is ridiculous, for example, to blame Mr. Harper for the recent economic downturn. It is equally ridiculous to complain about the deficit spending necessary both here and around the world to change the current economic climate.
Those arguing that we shouldn't spend the money are speaking from a fantasy world of ideology that we can no longer afford. Old-style Conservatism is dead, at least for now. And it was Mr. Harper who killed it, which does not speak well for his continued leadership of his party.
As Canadians, we are going to have to pull together to fix this problem. Let's hope we relearn some of the values that our forebearers demonstrated when they founded this country - concern for each other, and a willingness to put the good of the nation over our personal desires and downright greed.
Ironically, those are the very values that Mr. Layton's party has always espoused, but from the look of comments on these threads, not many Canadians still share those ideals because of ideological blinders.
Just remember that it was unbridled capitalism that got us into this mess. It's unlikely to get us out.
Michael
said
Canadians need stability right now, and not only are his actions offering it now; they are demanding it moving forward.
It's about time someone had the prudence and pragmatism to do the right thing.
Al
said
Pete from TO
said
Do you think anyone is funding the Liberals?! are you going to suggest there isn't a split in that party?!
This is the budget the Coalition held the Governemnt hostage in order to get, what exactly are you complaining about?
Michale J Kingston
said
Any idea what the deficit and
debt was when Mulroney left power? Wasn't it around $40 billion?
LivinDayToDay
said
Thank you Lib, NDP, BLOC for making the PCs act in Canada's interests and not playing politics. I do enjoy the irony; a coalition political game has forced the leadership to stop playing political games.
Mike from Ottawa
said
I can see it all now in another year or so. The Liberals and Bloc will form a coalition and take over the entire country......yep the separatists and all new Canadians of the last 20 years or so will make all of us middle class Conservatives pay even more for forever supporting Quebec and the welfare bums that we have inherited. Way to go Iggy, you have made a triumphant return!!
Jack Layton
said
Choosing to vote against the budget even before it is introduced is completely out of line. That's not even politics - Layton is just being difficult now.
I used to have respect for you Mr. Layton. I even thought you might be a viable option to the Conservatives, but you have completely lost all my respect with this stunt.
Go Harper.
Maggie
said
proud Canadian, but wasn't under Lib leadership
said
the sponsership scandal;
the mp who stated that it's his privilege to spend taxpayer's money for travel;
withholding ei funding to build a *surplus*; accountability refusal; hitting middle-income families with higher taxes; the embarassment of being a Canadian...this was the federal leadership and running of the Wonderful Liberal Party less than FIVE years ago.
The Liberal party? The "we let you in the PMO Harper so you'd better follow our advisement" attitude is LAUGHABLE!
From the East
said
"There is a group of Conservatives that are talking about splitting from Harpers dysfunction and forming their own Party."
Did nobody learn anything over the Alliance Party Split? It created such a devision in the conversative vote that we were saddled with the Cretien government for ten years. You want to give a gift to the Liberal Party, split the conservative vote again.
DGL
said
Andrea
said
I think the liberals would do well in a minority, and the majority is more tricky.
Cindy in Ontario
said
The liberals think they are in power as they say they are putting the current elected government on probation.
The conservatives have bowed to the liberals and the NDP in more then one way...you see the middle class still did not get anything in this budget and according to Iggy, if the budget contained broadbased tax cuts for the middle class they would vote against the harper budget.
There is no need for another election to see if Iggy would form the next government...he is already pulling the strings in Ottawa.
Shame on Harper for giving in to him and the other two stooges. We once again have a spineless Prime Minister trying to lead this once great Nation!
to Diane,
I already get shafted on the budget and taxes...if I can get something done in my home and not have to pay further pst or gst then by God I am gonna do it! McGuinty has taken so much from the Ontarians in the form of taxes and the current government takes 22% of my pay weekly and I done come near the 45K mark!
Edwin from Toronto
said
They are not suppose to "oppose" everything the the ruling party did.
They suppose to seek compromise or force the ruling party to compromise on important issues.
It is quite an easy job to be an opposition party if they can just put negative vote on everything.
Get out of the way to save the economy - NDP
Torontonian
said
To all those who are saying that a new right-wing party is being formed, that's the best news I've ever heard. We could use a divided right again to make sure that they don't get re-elected.
And to John K, have you looked at the electoral map lately? The total amount of seats west of Ontario (including the territories) is 80. Quebec alone has 75 (Ontario has 106). And the amount that the Tories got in the '905' is much less than what the other parties got in the Vancouver area alone. So, it would be ill-advised to say that Quebec and Ontario's electoral strength is 'irrelevant'.
Prof. Pye Chartt
said
-----------------------------
"The simple message they want to get out is if you don't like Stephen Harper look to the NDP. The Liberals aren't the party you should be looking to, they're clones of the Tories so vote NDP," said CTV's Roger Smith."
-----------------------------
"If you look at this poll right now, basically it means the Tories are nowhere in Quebec, the Liberals are coming on fast, and when an election happens in a year's time when this recession is over, the Liberals could be poised to do very, very well in Quebec," Fife said."
-----------------------------
What's with the electioneering nonsense?! Like virtually all Canadians, I'm more than sick and tired of the worthless politics. We have a duly-elected Prime Minister. We have a government. Give it a rest, for heaven's sake.
WE WANT THE POLITICIANS COMPRISING OUR PARLIAMENTARY GOVERNMENT TO GOVERN THIS COUNTRY NOW!
Quit trying to drag us backwards all the time.
Bob in Winnipeg
said
You have to admire a man who has so many back room deals running all at one time. (not)
Say goodnight Jack your time is up.
Richard Murray
said
Am I a Conservative? You bet your sweet patootie. If we are ever going to get this country straightened out, these are the people we need in a majority position in Ottawa.
It was hilarious to see Talaban Jack and Gilles The Shill go through their contortions yesterday in front of the TV camera's.
I notice that Ignatieff, having no other choice, has meekly "assumed the position".
Hey Danny W., out there in stormy Newfoundland... every good fisherman knows, if you piss over the windward side of the boat, you get wet.
roy
said
Mark
said
The only concern is knowing Uggy is one of those crafty Liberal lawyers and may be looking for extra inside information he can use for the benefit of himself or his friends, and not to necessarily to help the country.
Dan Riley
said
Democracy in action.
WestofTheRockies
said
Oh hey, now here's an idea, how about a Thank You but we're doing better now we don't need as much. Nope you and your Premier are like spoiled children.
Given a choice between the original deal and a new deal he chooses the original AND all the benefits of the New Deal. Then when he's told it's either one or the other, not both he throws a tantrum.
We’re tired of supporting you and then being kicked in the shins because you’re not happy
Shut up!
dan riley in Vancouver
said
Democracy in action.
It's My Canada
said
As far as your contractors who work for cash, I think it's about time they started paying taxes just like the rest of us! Let's have some honesty there too, not just when it's convenient for you.
But Gary, thanks for letting all of us know what kind of snakes who don't pay taxes that supported the coalition.
Gus
said
Kerry In Calgary
said
Brian
said
Craig in Edmonton
said
When the Liberals do something it is reportes as "the Liberals are establishing a strong lead" or the "Conservatives are nowhere".
Everyone knows the economy is the issue right now and no party wants to go to the electorate as a result, this is why Ignatieff is doing what he is by saying the Conservatives are on probation.
Wake up people, the Liberals are spinning reality again here and the media is being played by pollsters who are giving you the data they want you to see. This data is like Alberta weather, don't like it wait 10 minutes, it's not an indictment or endorsment of any party.
Frank Buchan (Vauxhall, Alberta by way of Ontario)
said
The argument against deficit spending has nothing to do with ideology.
Government spending has never worked against structural recessionary pressure. In the US more than a trillion dollars has produced no discernable economic traction. Resources are limited, and how we apply them now restricts future choices. We are throwing money at symptoms.
For government to borrow to develop capital has a potential productivity impact; borrowing to sustain operations does not. Government will eventually be faced by a dilemma: increase taxes significantly to offset inflationary pressures in inefficient entrenched service provisions; or abandon services. Not curtailing services in a controlled way configures the country for a chaotic collapse.
The poster went on to write, “Just remember that it was unbridled capitalism that got us into this mess.”
That assertion is wrong. What perpetuated this mess worldwide was consistent regulatory malfunction, combined in Canada with a massive increase in social funding during the Trudeau era that was unmanaged by subsequent governments.
If our government is running a deficit because of operations it has two rational choices: cut services, or raise taxes to cover shortfalls. As a populace, we have to ask if what we get in return for our taxes has enough value to tax us more heavily, or, as in the case of deficit, tax future generations more heavily.
The fantasy is that we can abdicate our responsibility and leave the task to future generations, at the same time as we cripple their future access to resources. The same fundamental argument applies to governance, public debt, environment, and most other long-term human interactions.
Some of us prefer not to let others clear our messes.
Doug BC
said
I was Liberal.I am now Conservative.Not because I like everything about the Conservative policies,or dislike everything about Liberal policies.Anyone who agrees entirely with any one of the parties,is either to partisan,or simply ignorant of the facts.
If a united Canada is to survive,citizens need to stop thinking we will do better just by changing the faces in Parliament.That is simply re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
We need to change "the way" we govern.This system is to adversarial to be effective.After the election the real "coalition" should be between the two parties that got the lions share of the support.Not with the ones who exist on the fringes of either a left wing ideology,or a right wing ideology.Both the BLOC and the NDP simply pander to which ever party needs their votes to keep the government in office.
In minority situations,if a compromise is needed to deal with an issue,that compromise should be between the government and the official opposition.Not some fringe party with limited support.
We NEED the expertise of BOTH the Liberals and the Conservatives.That is where most Canadians are.
Trudeau abandoned the political centre to get support from the NDP.They stayed out in left field so long that they might now be labeled NDP Lite.
Ontario thinks Harper is to right wing.Alberta thinks Liberals are socialists.Both have a right to their own lifestyles,and neither should rule the other.
The real threat to unity in Canada,is our inability to resolve that.I am not fan of Harpers,but better that than being dictated to by Ontario socialists.
REFORM THE SENATE.I may then be more willing to listen.
Ig is King???......
said
He knows that the majority of Canadians just want this whole mess to be over with. Most did not want a coalition government.
If he allows the budget to pass he gets a few things back in his own pocket.
He gets support from the Liberal Canadians, he gets a pat on the back from the Conservative Canadians and he gets a year or two to prepare for an election.
He feels he is above our PM, putting him on probation? Come on, the only person really who can put our PM on probation is the GG.
He looks like he is taking the high road but is just sitting back waiting and waiting until the opportunity to pounce, blame all the world economic troubles on the PM and bash our government to bits. Then, he will begin campaigning to win the election. Worst is, he just fell into the seat, never earned it and never was elected into it. Opposition Party Leader DESIGNATE. Hail King Ig. I still don't trust him.
Brenda
said
diane ontario
said
MaryAnn/ Calgary
said
Concened Canadian
said
Thanks for your comments Frank, which seem intelligent and respectful. Can I just raise two things in response?
When I said "unbridled capitalism" I was referring to the lack of regulation which you also cite. Capitalism is a very powerful economic engine, but as we have seen, without proper oversight it seems to tear itself apart.
As for your other point concerning social programs here in Canada- weren't we able to have government surpluses while funding those programs? You say this was consistently unmanaged - I'm not sure what you mean here, but it seems that we can afford government social programs and run at least a balanced budget as long as the economy is sound, wouldn't you say?
In fact, isn't it the ethical thing to do for us to ensure that we don't pass on deficits to future generations, nor environmental catastrophe, while meeting our social obligations to the less fortunate?
Anyway, my main point is that we need a new paradigm for thinking about our economic/environmental health in the context of our mutual social obligations. I don't see that extreme points of view, from either left or right, will allow us to achieve that. As we have seen, communism collapsed because of economic inefficiency, while unregulated capitalism tears itself to shreds while destroying much of the social fabric.
What can we do to solve these problems?
Cheers
condogirl in Edmonton
said
Liberals do well in Edmonton - never gonna happen Mr. Fife, and how many seats did the Liberals lose in Ontario in the last election????
R of N.L.
said
Mary in Calgary
said
I hope you run for office. Very well put. : )
Patricia
said
Prof. Pye Chartt
said
"The fantasy is that we can abdicate our responsibility and leave the task to future generations, at the same time as we cripple their future access to resources. The same fundamental argument applies to governance, public debt, environment, and most other long-term human interactions."
Thanks, Frank, for your rational condemnation of our overblown budget. (Your post deserves full reading.)
Canadians tend to be very "dependent" thinkers with regard to this issue. Because some wonky liberal economists and politicos in other nations have embraced flooding the economy with public (and borrowed) money, we seem to consider it OBVIOUS that this is the way out of our troubles.
While a sensible argument can be made for such massive "shot-gun" federal spending by our American neighbours, given their entrenched plight (and the genesis of it), with Canada traditionally riding on the U.S.'s coattails it stands to simple reason that their inevitable rising tide will surely lift our boat...and, therefore, plunging into unprecedented spending-driven debt in Canada is needless and even foolish.
Oh, well. Full-speed ahead. The course has already been set. The "Hail Mary" pass has been thrown. ...Sorry, kids.
Bill Arends
said
"Ontario thinks Harper is to right wing.Alberta thinks Liberals are socialists.Both have a right to their own lifestyles,and neither should rule the other.
The real threat to unity in Canada,is our inability to resolve that.I am not fan of Harpers,but better that than being dictated to by Ontario socialists."
And he is somewhat correct as unity is the problem but there is no solution if we think this way. It is not a compromise but a solution we are seeking.
Unity needs to be achieved at the grass roots level not just in parliament. When we the people vote we need to think what is best for Canada not BC or Alberta or Ontario.
As Pierre Elliott Trudeau said “Canada will be a strong country when Canadians of all provinces feel at home in all parts of the country, and when they feel that all Canada belongs to them.”
Kris in Toronto
said
I have news for you:
Regulatory malfunction (fancy way to say no oversight) = unbridled capitalism.
And blaming Trudeau for this economic crisis? That's rich man. He was PM, when, like 30 - 40 years ago?
Gotta love when Conservatives are backed into a corner, they all whip out "Trudeau" and "socialism".
Well, all I know is whenever we have Liberal governments our country prospers and usually our debt gets paid, doesn't get increased.
OldTeddyBear
said
Alex (Toronto)
said
It is obvious that any option that Mr. Ignatieff chose would have been criticized by some people; in fact, some commentators on the far left and the far right were prepared to attack Ignatieff no matter what choice he made. That's just a flaw on the part of the extremists, not Ignatieff.
The reality is that the Canadian electorate includes a wide range of perspectives that barely fit into the existing four-and-a-few-more parties we have now. Responsible parties and party leaders have to look at policies, not personalities and optics. That's what Mr. Ignatieff has done, and what the Conservatives have been forced to do.
The only choice the NDP is ever going to have is whether to support a Conservative minority or a Liberal one. They're going to get that choice, this year or next year. They probably should not paint themselves into a corner if they want to play a role when the opportunity does arise. Layton's base of urban voters actually want their policies enacted, which can only happen if the NDP leaves a door open to cooperation with Liberals in the near future.
laughterrocks
said
Zinjo - Vancouver
said
Layton, ever the opportunist, is no doubt steaming over loosing his opportunity to form some sort of government, but hey, he'll get his chance to bring down yet another government in the months to come, if Harper continues his old habits.
This is more about stabilizing our economy to benefit the electorate, not ideologies or opportunism.
As for the maritimes, the only way for them to get back their oil profits is to bring back a Liberal government in a majority. These Conservatives are bought and paid for by Alberta oil, not Maritime oil...
For those who "claim" to be former Liberals, give us "real" liberals a break! We know the smell of manure when it wafts its way on to these boards and it fools no one...
I was no fan of Dion, but it was never enough for me to change what I believe or my ideology. I remember the Mulroney years and how it took the Libs a decade to balance the books. No thanks, not again!
This budget isn't the best we could have had, but it is certainly a stabilizing influence on the markets, which is critical for us to weather this storm.
Linda in Vancouver
said
BUT,people even more conservative than I am,while having good reason to feel less than happt here,should be careful about another version of the Reform Pary.
I don't take exception to their views,or their right to be heard.What I fear is hat his simply shoots all people with any kind of conservaive view in he foot by handing all of Canada back to the socialsits in eastern Canada.That would be the best hing you could do for Taliban Jack and his cousins in the thieving Liberal party.
This is a bad budget for any conservative.But we also have to take a little water in our wine.We can be thankful that Canadians have moved slightly right in he last few years.And a big part of that is as a result of people like Preston Manning preaching about the hazzards of big debt,and big taxes.
More and more Canadians are taking that same view now.Progress may be to slow,because the task is quite large.But we should remain united.We will not get everything,but we can make a positive difference in changing the attitudes of the big taxers,and the big debt supporters.
Now is not the time to get off the bus,and put socialists back in the drivers set.We need to fight to get "the best deal we can from what is available".
That is the ONLY way to move Canada forward.
James from Vancouver
said
While regular Canadians suffer, the banks are the ones who are going to be making money hand over fist for years to come as they collect interest on all the new loans, credit card bills, re-mortgaged houses etc that desperate Canadians are getting stuck with. Why are we giving the masters of Greed $50 BILLION BONUS when everybody else is tightening their belts?
Gary Thunder
said
GARY THUNDER, you're starting to sound like Jack Layton. He's a sore loser too.
As far as your contractors who work for cash, I think it's about time they started paying taxes just like the rest of us! Let's have some honesty there too, not just when it's convenient for you.
But Gary, thanks for letting all of us know what kind of snakes who don't pay taxes that supported the coalition.
=============================
Most of the 'Snakes' you refer to are off duty cops, firemen,city workers and others who have a lot of time on their hands and run contracting businesses on the side.They do pay taxes.
That $3,000 renovation job under the table will now cost $10,000 and cause inflation which we don't need.
I don't like and do not think we need the government running huge deficits.
All I see in this budget is handouts that saddle us with debt and will not create 1 job, but make a lot of bankers and large corporations rich.
Conservatives used to stand for less government, now they are just tax collectors.
Fed Up with whiners
said
As for Jack and Gilles (sic), they can pick up their ball and go home. They don't want to play anymore. Acting like petulant children. I hope Canadians who voted for those 2 clowns remember this in the next election get rid of them and the rest of their ilk.
And now we need a real Conservative party in this country. This budget was written by Liberals.
Hunter Mars
said
The rules must be revamped to protect more Canadians .
Regionalism does not work .
All unemployed should be treated equally whether you live in Cornerbrook or Victoria .
Donna/BC
said
I think what people are so passionate about stems right back to the announcement of "the coalition". While understanding the process, I was still horrified that we would actually have a parliament in place that "the people" did not elect. This was like a third world dictatorship closing in.
No, the budget doesn't help me or my family in any way; BUT for the good of the entire country in this GLOBAL RECESSION, I hope that the initiatives in this budget will stimulate and help our people, cities and provinces where needed.
1. Look back into history what the Liberals have done.
2. It was often said (in Liberal times) that "as long as Ontario is happy, to hell with the rest of the country".
3. MEDIA heavily influenced by the Liberals. Perhaps some positive reporting and positive comments, even in this trying time, would be easier and helpful for the good of the entire country.
We now watch as the rest of the world deals with this recession. Hopefully our politicans and citizens will concentrate on surviving this global recession.
Rob
said
Harper rejoins the Liberal Party.
said
Tono, it's the US that's in an incredible mess.
said
Canada just has its usual Parliamentary politics . . . far superior to the criminal antics of the US Congress.
More money left in my pocket please
said
I think once the budget is settled and established we need to hold the government accountable for other costs we continue to bear at a higher price than should be....
Laughing in Calgary
said
SVCR
said
Gilles only worries about iddy biddy Quebec and could careless about the rest of Canada.
What does he actually think he is proving when his party does not even exist as a powering body in Canadian politics, just Quebec politics which needs to find a Ford light for a better idea!!!!!!!!
Harper dithered and dithered until
said
Harper, gratefully, obeyed.
I don't hear Harper giving Ignatieff any grief.
said
Yes, sir, Mr. Ignatieff, sir.
KRB
said
We were also bringing in only 97 cents per dollar of program expenditure, meaning we were in deficit even before taking into account debt servicing charges.
That was the worst we've ever had it, fiscally speaking, during peacetime in this country.
Frank Buchan (Vauxhall, Alberta by way of Ontario)
said
Qualifying your "unbridled capitalism" comment gives your view more weight. Failure to regulate any system is a mistake, and I was partly trying to observe it’s not correct to blame the concept of capitalism for our human failure to manage it. I suppose I was being overly specific, but I find these issues today are suffering from generalisations.
Early on our social program funding didn’t cause immediate deficit because in good times we could/can sustain a fairly large rate of burn. The problem is government became complacent about how to sustain those programs during tough times. What I meant by "consistently unmanaged" was that rather than regularly review and optimise social programs, they feared entitlement – and when that happened they became afraid to manage the programs for our betterment.
It is absolutely vital to meet social obligations to the less fortunate. That, in fact, is one of my most basic concerns. Lack of expenditure control today will drain future resources and options. Unless we aggressively consider the options we have presently, and are willing to shoulder some pain, we are betraying the people who are counting on us to correct mistakes – and ensuring they have far fewer options in future.
I agree extreme viewpoints are problematic. Balance is the key, but to find it you need to actually look...and part of my point, I suppose, is that it seems that we have stopped looking, probably for fear of what we might find. What we would find first and foremost is that we can fix all of this in our lifetimes with almost nothing unbearable, but we seem to lack the courage of the founders of the country.
I would jot more, but that dastardly 300 word limit is not really capable of handling detailed analysis of anything.
If there are any genuine conservatives
said
Frank Buchan (Vauxhall, Alberta by way of Ontario)
said
Your "news" to me is obscured by the tone of your message, but I have some further thoughts to share.
Regulatory malfunction is unrelated to a system of economy. The same regulatory malfunctions killed communism. You cannot blame a system of economy for the choices made by its participants. Greed is real, but it is about the people, not the system. As for whether regulatory malfunction means oversight, it does not: regulation is systemic, and oversight is the application of systemic policy. I was observing the actual failure was with the system in place to govern oversight, which guaranteed the oversight would eventually fail.
Notably, I did not "blame" Trudeau. In fact, I have great respect for him. His idea of a social network was admirable and ethically sound; but, after it was installed, subsequent governments ignored a need to manage it for sustainability. Trudeau himself, if he were alive, would probably agree on the point. To sustain any program, social or otherwise, you must treat it as a means to an end, not an end in itself. Social programs are not an entitlement, they are a privilege we can afford – but we will lose them unless we manage them.
I am a conservative, and will not apologise for it. I will note I never mentioned socialism, and I am not feeling cornered by anything much today.
As for your contention Liberal governments manage the economy better, I refer you to how the last two Liberal Prime Ministers managed to run surpluses. Ignore the taxation issue entirely, and reflect on downloading. Had this economic downturn struck while either was Prime Minister, we would be in the exact position we are now, because all but one driver in this recession is external to Canada.
Mal
said
Joleen Watson
said
Des from the Peg
said
Ian
said
Bill Withers
said
Dan
said
Iggy is misleading the public
said
Just another example of the Liberals trying to wow the public with lies. Iggy is the same as all other Liberals, misleading, do anything for power.
Atleast Harpers policies benefit the average Canadians life. I'd rather a flip flopper than a liar!!!!!!!!!
Chris Hein
said
So Layton, stop acting like a baby that lost his lollypop, lick your wounds and move on, or die in your own vile.
Kim in Calgary
said
Then I guess the leader of your conservative party was not the leader that he has led you to believe. Funny how most Canadians could see this. The budget is presented by the Conservative party and as such is a Conservative budget - let's ensure we keep this point factual shall we.
Mike in Edmonton
said
Their true colours are showing!
Leadership?
said
I am sure that there are many like me who are totally disgusted with their childishness.
And some people wonder why some Canadians would like to have a leader with character, like Obama.
Our parliament is pathetic!
Right now the world is looking at us as an example of a country who is doing fairly well during the global economic downturn, and I shudder to imagine what they are thinking of our juvenile leaders.
Ian
said