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Do-not-call list made situation 'worse,' says group
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CTV.ca News Staff
Date: Thu. Jan. 15 2009 10:36 PM ET
After its launch last September, Canadians added more than 2.7 million phone numbers to the national do-not-call list.
But now, with nearly 6 million numbers registered, many Canadians who signed up are feeling duped because they're receiving more telemarketing calls than ever before.
That's because the do-not-call list may have gotten into the wrong hands.
To access the list, a telemarketer simply has to go to the National Do Not Call List website, enter the appropriate information and pay a small fee.
The problem is, anyone can pose as a telemarketer and obtain the list. If they're willing to break the rules, they could then call the numbers, which are all recent.
And if that list makes its way to a telemarketer outside Canada, the CRTC does not have the jurisdiction to stop them from calling Canadian numbers.
Eleanor Friedland, vice-president of the Consumers Council of Canada, said the situation is "now worse than it was before."
"If you don't have somebody checking up on it, how do you know it's working or how do you know bad guys aren't taking advantage of it," Friedland told CTV.ca on Thursday.
"We want to make certain that whatever loopholes exist are filled."
She said the CRTC needs more power to enforce the new rules.
"It should be fully staffed and the money has to be there to pay staff if that's what has to happen to check up on it," Friedland said.
"Otherwise, what's the point of putting in something that's to protect consumers if you don't watch out for the bad guys."
The CRTC says that the do-not-call registry has been a success and that an increase in unwanted calls cannot be absolutely attributed to the registry.
Lynne Fancy of the CRTC told CTV.ca that they are seeing "positive feedback from Canadians, that they have actually seen a reduction in the number of calls."
"In terms of an increase of calls . . . telemarketers can obtain calling lists from a wide variety of different sources, and these sources are unrelated to either the CRTC or the national do-not-call list," she added.
But the list has no shortage of critics.
Michael Geist, a law professor at the University of Ottawa and prominent national commentator on technology, says the do-not-call list is so flawed he likes to call it the "do-not-hesitate-to-call-list."
He said the list of exemptions -- which include registered charities, political parties and candidates, and newspapers selling subscriptions -- is so extensive that there aren't many organizations forced to abide by the new rules.
"In many instances the calls haven't stopped because the law permits those organizations to continue to make the calls," he said.
Geist also said jurisdiction flaws have provided a clear loophole for telemarketers.
"We've seen almost from the very outset, organizations set up shop outside the country and call using either automated calls, robocalls or just regular calls coming from outside Canada -- which is beyond the CRTC's jurisdiction," Geist told CTV.ca.
The CRTC maintains that they will take action against those misusing the do-not-call registry.
"Any telemarketer can access that list, but if anyone is found to be misusing the list, then we will be taking action," Fancy said.
When asked what actions the CRTC would take against telemarketers overseas, Fancy replied: "The CRTC will take all the complaints we receive seriously and will conduct investigations and if we find an organization or person is misusing the list, then we will take the actions we can do.
"We have the right to impose penalties."
John Lawford, counsel at Public Interest Advocacy Centre in Ottawa told CTV.ca that the CRTC can impose fines of up to $15,000 per call against a company or up to $1,500 per call against an individual.
But he also said fines could be as low as one cent per call.
More than a year ago, Geist called for a "mutual recognition" approach between Canada and the U.S., which also has a do-not-call list.
The law would prevent anyone in the U.S. or Canada to call numbers on either do-not-call list.
Still, that wouldn't stop calls coming from overseas.
Geist said even domestically, the CRTC has been inundated with complaints.
He was so fed up with the "designed to fail" program that he set up his own website www.ioptout.ca, which allows Canadians to tell exempted organizations that they don't want to be contacted.
"From the CRTC level, they've got to accelerate some of the complaints, hand out significant fines where appropriate and send a strong message to the market that this is a law with some teeth and the CRTC stands ready to enforce it," he said.
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I applaud the budget, even though Health Care and education may stay unscathed. Sadly this cannot last and I worry to later this year where cuts will become enviable. If anything, this provides the Wildrose Alliance plenty of ammo when an election is called.


Comments are now closed for this story
Richard
said
"Hi, I am calling from..."click, I hang up, I don't speak, just hang up, easy and simple.
Gerry Mccowan
said
Kevin in Vancouver
said
Ki-Som Victoria
said
Jamie
said
On the other I believe, very strongly, that telemarketing ought to be illegal. If I'm not already doing business with someone, they have no right to call me at my home.
chris in hanover
said
Frank
said
Jim Nauss
said
fitzz
said
Perhaps a more direct approach by taxpayers is needed. One of the major national parties, to which I had previously contributed, persisted in mailing me. I told them "Once more and no more funding from me." They did and I DID too!
Dirk Diggler
said
Sparky in Kitchener
said
This way I can have a laugh at them and I now look forward to their calls.
I know>>>>>>I must be really lonely!
Fred
said
Combo of Call Display and Call Screen. If you don't recognize the number, don't answer. If it's a robocall and they won't give up, add them to Call Screen (up to 12 numbers - not enough, but it helps with the worst offenders).
What doesn't work:
DNC list. It's worse than simply not effective. The list is basically a DO call list for TMs outside the country. Put your number(s) on that list and you're just about guaranteed to get more calls than ever!
One other thing we discovered: Indent-A-Call, which we had but weren't using, was tripling our load of junk calls. Once we dumped that service, the load dropped significantly.
Frustrated
said
DEEP NNN
said
It does help to have caller ID and voice mail just in case.
It's been very quiet since a month after the Registry was started.
Marc Coquitlam B.C.
said
I have call display from Telus. It is a joke. Telus allows callers to have their number blocked, and then tried to sell me a service to block the blocked numbers. I thought that is why I had call display?
Now I pick up the phone, and leave the caller hanging on the line until they give up and hang up. Seen as time is money, their companies lost productivity should be reason enough for them to refrain from calling our house.
Who gives a ish?
said
Billy
said
Barb
said
R D
said
Anneke, Ottawa
said
You can't block them because they have blocked their number.
You can't report them because they don't give their company name and force you to call them if you want to tell them personally not to call. And they use fake company names which change... and are already on fraud watch lists but still manage to continue harassing and defrauding.
Paul Labatte, Toronto ON
said
Rain
said
Now I'll have to go back to my old system - yelling and swearing at them. Usually gets rid of them after one or two attempts.
Nicole Brousseau
said
Alex Nelson
said
bernse
said
marie ott
said
they are annoying that is all I know. however I will say that call display is the best feature I have ever paid for! mostly if it is a long dist number I dont recognize I dont pick up and most of the time it seems to be a telemarketer. whoever dreamed this up in govt has egg on their face or is getting a kick back from someone.
Nicole
said
Jeanne from B.C.
said
Waste Their Time!
said
M Morris
said
Please don't leave a message.
said
Jacqueline
said
I got two calls from newspapers and I asked them to put me on their no-call list, and that's it.
I've never wasted my money on call display, because people can block their numbers. I have call answer. If I'm busy, I don't pick up. If it's important, someone can leave a message.
Ned Nocall
said
Keith in Oshawa
said
Sparky in Kitchener
That was hilarious !! Reminds me of something similar I pulled with my brother..they never did call back after the game of tag
we played with them.
Jim Scouten
said
Sonia
said
Jun in Surrey
said
Lucy AB
said
Jeannie Skead, ON
said
J Colter
said
John in Mtl
said
Claude
said
Steve B.
said
Bob in Harley
said
Joe
said
Charlie
said
Matty
said
Marvin ( please withold info )
said
Very Simple.
Just add your local MP / MLA / Alderman / Mayor's locale telephone # to the " D.N.C.L. " and PRESTO-CHANGO !
You'd be surprised at the results.
Jim in BC
said
Annoyed, Coquitlam BC
said
Ryder
said
dee
said
The phone companies have now made cell phones capable of displaying what ever number the caller wishes , gee why do I get calls from 0-000-000-0000. Can't block it with telus's block either because it is not a recognized area code grrrr. I get em at home and on my cell now that I have registered with the do not call list.
Mountain Man
said
Al Alltalk
said
Brett (Vancouver)
said
Every time you put your phone number down for a raffle, promotion, credit card application, warranty form, or retail sales person... your opening yourselves up for telemarketing.
STOP GIVING OUT YOUR PHONE NUMBER.
I get maybe 2 telemarketing calls a week, one from big brothers asking if I have anything to donate (which I don't mind), the other from my wife's bank. 2 Calls a week is nothing to complain about.
It's the same as email spam. NEVER give out your primary email address if you don't want spam.
I have a yahoo account for everything that is not family/friends/business. I don't even use my main email for this site. Guess what... I get zero spam.
Stop griping because you had out your information to pretty much everyone, and act surprised when someone uses it to contact you.
Learn the system, and play within it.
spencer
said
Shafiq
said
Teresa Calbeck
said
Dylan
said
Laura - Saint John
said
Darryl from P.A.
said
Now if I get unwanted calls and the mood hits me,I see how long I can keep them on the line.Asking as many questions as I can think of and repeat a few of them. (personal best just under 10 minutes)
then polity tell them that for the last so many minutes they have not been able to bother anyone else, I have never heard from any of them again.
Darryl
Cambob
said
A few years ago I had a telemarketer call me while I was cooking dinner. The call distracted me long enough that my dinner burned. So I called a lawyer, gave him the telemarketing company info and we sued them for $4,000. They settled about 4 months later for $2,000+legal costs.
Did this stop all telemarketers from calling me? Nope!
Telemarketers are basically commercials. We live in a "commercial" society, and anyone who believes their phone is "off limits" is really being foolish.
smart one..
said
why would you even buy into this? its just another way for them to make money.
Khai
said
Don from Ottawa
said
bill
said
John in Toronto
said
Anne - Brantford, ON
said
Perhaps the CRTC should have software that will turn foreign IP addresses away. I've been to American sites that will not allow me to sign up for something because I am in Canada.
Gordon in Sarnia
said
These people are now managers at Nortel.
Ron - New Westminster, BC
said
I guess there is a (small) percentage of people in this world who will complain about absolutely everything absolutely all of the time.
However they were no doubt the ones that were complaining that the government wasn't doing anything to stop the telemarketers so maybe I need to thank them for encouraging the government to make the attempt to fix the problem in the first place???
Steve in PEI
said
Gina
said
Stewie Griffin
said
TerryG
said
Rodger in Calgary
said
John in TO
said
robert saint amour
said
Jim Love
said
webstir
said
It is suppose to kick in this month sometime.
My wife recieved a call on her cell phone and our cell phones are also on the do not call list.
If(if) we still get calls on our cell phone we are calling aliant and will end
the cell.Plain and simple.
Its bad enough to get these calls at home but on my cell I draw the line.
Dave Griffith
said
Don from Saskatchewan
said
My Scam Artist Extrodinaire was 1-877-889-2024. They called every night about 7 pm (Sundays about 2 p.m.)and not say ahything for 3 weeks. I took the phone off the hook, didn't say anything and left it off for 10 minutes and than hung up. After 2 nites, no more calls.
Deaf man in Ontario
said
Telemarketing continue to call us repeat same number because I could not answer with voice. They do not know how to use TDD and use voice. I cannot hear their voice and keep me bother. It is sad for them because they do not know how to communicate with deaf people on TDD without Bell Relay Service.
Randall from Ontario
said
The person apologizes and hangs up