CTV News | Historic first: Ontario in, N.L. out of equalization

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Historic first: Ontario in, N.L. out of equalization

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CTV.ca News Staff

Date: Mon. Nov. 3 2008 9:10 PM ET

Ontario, long considered the economic engine of Canada, will receive a federal equalization payment for the first time in its history. But Newfoundland and Labrador no longer needs the money, prompting Premier Danny Williams to say the "Newfie joke" is over.

Federal Finance Minister Jim Flaherty confirmed Monday that Ontario would receive about $347 million. The grants are usually reserved for "have not" provinces.

"Does it worry me? Yes of course it worries me," Flaherty told reporters at a news conference Monday afternoon. "The reality is, Ontario is entitled to enter the program and will be receiving substantial funds. Regrettably I think Ontario will be in the equalization program for some time to come."

Meanwhile, Newfoundland and Labrador, riding high on its offshore oil operation Hibernia, has now become a "have" province.

"This is a very proud day for Newfoundlanders and Labradorians," Williams said at a press conference.

"I don't think the Newfie joke is there anymore. I think we're now an example to our fellow Canadians of how it can be done and how to work your way through hardship."

Twenty years ago, when Newfoundland first announced its plans for Hibernia, then-premier Brian Peckford said: "One day the sun will shine and have-not will be no more."

Ontario, in recent years, has had a difficult time with its manufacturing industry because of the rising value of the Canadian dollar. Several auto manufacturing plants have closed in the past few years.

"It's an odd feeling to see Ontario in such difficult straits," Flaherty said. "We have to work together to try and build a stimulus in the economy."

The province was actually eligible for equalization payments in the 1970s but never received the funding. The program is designed so that richer provinces can help poorer provinces by providing them with the financial support they need to keep providing services.

The equalization payments will begin in January. Other provinces receiving payments are:

  • Quebec - $8.35 billion
  • Manitoba - $2.1 billion
  • New Brunswick - $1.69 billion
  • Nova Scotia - $1.57 billion
  • P.E.I. - $340 million

Flaherty spoke with reporters after meeting with his provincial counterparts in the morning to discuss the gloomy economic forecast and future plans for the equalization program.

The minister said Ottawa could not sustain the program's 15 per cent a year growth rate. He said the $13.6 billion equalization program will continue to grow but that costs would have to be capped to prevent bankrupting the system.

"I don't think Canadians will have any difficulty in saything that's the responsible thing to do," he said.

Flaherty said changes to the program have allowed the government to give Ontario about $100 million more than what it would have previously been able to give the province.

'Not unexpected'

Ontario Finance Minister Dwight Duncan said after the minister's meeting that he doesn't expect Ontario will be receiving the payments for very long.

"It was not unexpected and we'll continue to make the investments we're making," he told reporters.

Duncan said the money will help the province but that Ottawa needs to do more.

"Every bit helps," he said about the payment. "I would have preferred to see a government that's dealing with the automotive sector the way the European Union is, the way the United States is, with a $25 billion investment in the energy fund to help get the product mandate. There was nothing on that."

Duncan said the province would respond to the equalization program in greater detail in the future after officials have had a chance to go over the changes thoroughly.

"It would have been helpful for us to look at this before the meeting," he said. "It looks to us at the first glance that we won't qualify for very long based on the constraints they've put on it."

A report by TD Economics released last April predicted that Ontario would qualify for about $400 million in 2010-2011 and $1.3 billion the next year.

Heading into the meeting Monday, Duncan said Ottawa also needs to address health care transfers and fair treatment in employment insurance.

Meanwhile, oil-rich Alberta, which many view as being immune to the global economic crisis, will push for a co-ordinated assistance plan for the provinces, investors and manufacturers.

"Alberta's message today is that the volatility of the energy market, coupled with the downturn in the economy, is having a serious and profound impact on investors, on government and we have to do something to collectively benefit everybody in Canada," Alberta Finance Minister Iris Evans told Canada AM.

Quebec Finance Minister, Monique Jerome-Forget, said she has already told Flaherty that "given the current situation, we cannot cast aside our responsibilities at either the provincial or federal level."

"We have to be very pro-active as governments. I believe very, very, strongly that the situation now requires very active measures to counter the important slowdown, especially in terms of exports to the U.S."

Monday's meeting is being held ahead of a First Minister's meeting on the economy, to be hosted by Prime Minister Stephen Harper, in Ottawa next week.

Following that is U.S. President George Bush's summit of finance ministers from the top 20 economies, including Canada, to discuss the ongoing global financial crisis.

With files from The Canadian Press

Comments are now closed for this story

John E
said

Good Luck on the meeting. Unfortunately the Minister of Finance was the one cabinet post that Mr. Harper needed to change to get a more competent individual in there who could do the job, but I understand why he had to keep Flaherty there to give the air that he was not panicing and all is unfolding economically as the Conservatives had planned. Steady-hand-on-the- wheel and all that stuff. Even "Oil Rich" alberta will feel this one. Get use to it.......... Conservative times are hard times and that's what we voted for.


Grant
said

"Conservative times are hard times" EH?

I guess the whole world voted conservative.

Next time, put your glasses on, please.


Michael (Ottawa)
said

Finance Minister Jim Flaherty has a handle on what is going on and has made some changes which are beneficial to all Canadians long term.

This incessant left wing political bashing for no other reason than to demean is childish and immature.




Jimmyjim
said

I see that South Korea has launched a financial rescue package that would work well here in Canada.
South Korea is going to spend a large amount of money in infastructure renewal.
This exactly what Canada needs. Build and improve our highway system, improve our rail system, improve our harbours and airports. This has the advantage of creating jobs in a time when so many are being laid off. It also improves the economy by making transportation of raw material and finished products easier and cheaper.

This type of program has been done in the past in difficult times and has been successful. We also know our infastructure needs to be updated. Now is the time to invest in Canada for all Canadians. The work can be done with a bond issue.


Eric (from Calgary)
said

It is well known and demonstrated that Flaherty was not good for Ontario when he was their finance minister. Let's hope,, for the sake of Canada, that he recognizes that the majority of Canadians live in Ontario and it is time for the Federal Government to return some of the support Ontario has given to Canada since confederation.


Jimmyjim
said

I should also point out that a bond issue for infastructure renewal could be seen by investors as a safe place to put their money.


KJ in Kingston Ontario
said

Neil Young put it best in song: "I pay my dues ahead of time but when the benefits come I'm last in line."


Henry Wysmulek
said

Correct me if I am wrong, but was it not bob rae's ndp government that destroyed Ontario's finances?

Now on top of that you have an economic downturn, and all of a sudden it's the federal governments fault?




Jack - AB
said

Guess what people. Harper's federal government wants to limit, reduce or remove equalization payments to Ontario. I'm not surprised. Harper has lived in Alberta for the last 30 years so why would he care about helping Ontario out? Also, Harper is more concerned about racking up massive federal deficits instead of helping out the Provinces. Harper will slash away at social programs and spending anyway his party can until there is nothing left. He removed the Liberal surplus system ( gave big tax breaks to oil companies and banks ) and now has NO money left to spend on anything - meaning either Harper spends and runs BIG deficits or he does cutbacks and runs SMALLER deficits.

Do not whine or complain if you didn't vote or voted for Harper in Ontario or across Canada. This is who you wanted and voted for to lead Canada and now Ontario will get exactly what it should.


Sandy from the maritimes
said

I can sun up the financial crisis that we are facing in one equation.

Low income + high cost of living + no credit left = bad economy

Any questions?

My point being that money should not be giving out before a solid plan to deal with the equation is looked at.


wide awake
said

Cons this NDP that...bah bah bah
Lets all remember why equalization payments were started in the first place.
A Liberal ( yes Liberal )
government backed and pushed for industry to be stripped from Canada and centralized in ONT, equalization payments were created to pay provinces for revenue they were losing to ONT.
It was a foolish plan then and painfully apparent it doesn't work now. So point the finger where it belongs, at a past Liberal Dynasty not at current governments which have had to deal with the problem over the last 20 years, both liberal, NDP and CON
SO now everyone is scrambling to correct an old error, it took years to create this problem don't expect it to be solved in 6 months, no mater who is in power.


Trent
said

... If people were to budget like me and my family do nothing has changed for us,we still go out we still do all things we did before...This slow down has nothing to do with what party is in power it has to do with ecnomics.If you think you can do a better job then run for office.Other wise spend your money the way you want let the rest of do the samething.


SteveS - Hamilton, ON
said

I must laugh at those blaming the Federal Government for our (Ontario's) financial screw ups. The only thing that Dwight Duncan can do at this time is beg for money from Uncle Harper.... When the Liberal's took power in Ontario I remember saying to my wife - here we go - from first in terms of economic power to the bottom and Dalton did it!! let's start by taxing and spending billions more - 2 mins after saying they wouldn't.
The Conservatives have been in power in Alberta for a long time and they have created an economy that does well in the good times - but even in the poor times of low oil they had no Provincial Sales tax. To many people including the Liberal government of Ontario look for hand outs instead of taking responsibility. We've had a global correction that has almost never before been seen and we are not in a recession and yet the sky is falling... I wish the media was educated on their reporting so that they reported facts and not just fears


Centerist Tory
said

...Conservatives are elected because they manage best during hard times...Is this why the Liberals have hit the lowest popular vote in their history?


noel
said

Henry i agree 100%,Ontario whines its all the feds fault,How do you people down there figure that?Alberta pays big time to the rest of Canada to keep them afloat yet for years we have been treated like dirt.I am sure whatever needs to be done is being done,how does it feel Ontario to now have the shoe on the other foot.You keep voting in that useless Liberal government you reap what you sow!


Paul
said

Flahrety tried to warn the Ontario government that they were blowing it. Instead of taking the advice, they got all huffy about it, and now that time has proved the Ontario Liberals wrong they want to blame the people who tried to help them avoid the problem in the first place.


Pilgrim
said

To all the Yahoos from Ontario who have been offering ridicule to Newfoundland's Danny Williams and his warnings of broken promises by Harper and the boys, look no further - the prophecy has now been fulfilled!! Let's see how Ontarians feel about getting the proverbial shaft!!


alioops
said

What a surprise. A province with a Liberal government is looking to point fingers at the feds because they refuse to as liberals, admit to voters that they have squandered everything away.

Always blame someone else, and then demand they help you. It truly is the Liberal way.


noel
said

Just a thought but does anyone else see that all the provinces that have a Conservative provincial government are not stressing out and are doing quite well and all those with Liberal governments are toast?


Kim in Calgary
said

To Steve S in Hamilton, I am a native Calgarian and I think you need to have a better understanding of the facts....a significant employer in Alberta is the oil industry and unless you work in that industry, you do not get to share in the oil riches....not every Albertan is living the high life!!


Jaid in Toronto
said

It takes years to build something up but only a moment to destroy it.

We're truly masters of destruction.

You do what you have to do, regardless of what government we have, they do what they have to do.


Joee
said

Didn't Ontario complain about equalization payments for years before???


Edmonton John
said

Ontario's complaint about Flaherty's damaging comments is justified.

Argue Lib or Con and smirk and posture, and call each other names if you like.

But Flaherty should not have done what he did, and he better smarten up and pull for Canada. ...


Niagara George
said

I came upon Jim Flaherty walking ... on Front St. in Toronto, on Saturday evening.

He looked like the most miserable man on the street.
There wasn't a smile anywhere in his being.

He must have been thinking about the economy. Probably planning another idiotic move, like his reduction of the GST. Or perhaps it was how he could blame the Liberals for his impending deficit.




Daisy1
said

Last election was called by Harper's government...and given the other candidate and his agenda, there really was no where to go..not unlike a rock and a hard place. Hence, the conservatives got in again. Dang!

Harper doesn't like McGinty and quite frankly, I don't blame him. The guy just can't keep his promises to our province.

Ontario has on the whole enjoyed reasonable prosperity but now that that has changed drastically, we do indeed expect the rules not to change and be properly and legally "equalized."


The old lady
said

Noel from out west you are absolutley right. Glad your province does so well. You say you got dirt but look what you have done with the dirt OIL SANDS good for you out there.
However we all did not vote Liberal or Bob Rae's NDP and we are hurting now. We need help big time. Probably for just a little while.


Steve from Calgay
said

...Ontario has approx. 12 million people, canada has 33 million. How in heavens name does that constitute ontario has a majority of the people in this country.Ontario has gotten itself in the mess it is by it's own policies of spending and taxing the people to death. Having said that,when tougher times come along, and they always do, they don't have the ability to sustain a quality of live they have been used to.... biting the bullet and paying OFF your provincial debt is the only way to weather the storms that come along.
I know what it's like to live there. I was born and brought up in Toronto until I came to my senses and moved to Calgary.


Mike S
said

A little bit of History here, There was 2 provinces in canada including Ontario that voted to have an NDP goverment, they where voted out due to mis-management and overspending. now both the Liberals and consevatives are being blame for what is hapening right now with the econamy. Who is trully to blame.

...I voted inthe last election both provencial and federal for teh liberals. Not the conservatives. I can voice my opinion.


DCR-Toronto
said

ok...are you people serious? Ontario gets equalization, but thats not enough. Flaherty said that Ontario is the last place in the world others would WANT to invest in. Not that they shouldn't. That was due to LIBERAL policies in Ontario of over taxation. The Conservatives warned Dalton and the boys over a year ago to get ready for this. They chose to ignore the warnings. Don't blame The federal government for what the McGuinty government sewed for the past 5 years!


Mike in Ottawa
said

It's sort of sad to see the lack of patriotism here for our country. Everyone ties themselves to their province and pits each one against the other. Alberta's the best, no Ontario's the best! It's just ridiculous I think. And to say either of those provinces pay the others is a matter of opinion since many of the workers in your provinces come from other parts of the country to enable your industries to continue to operate. Other provinces lose income tax to your provinces because most of the work just happens to be done there. In Ontario, it all started because of the proximity to the US; now in Alberta it's because of oil....but bear in mind it will run out...then what. It will shift somewhere else for one reason or another; then that province will be whining about having to pay for the rest of the country to have an adequate level of service...imagine that.


John in the best province in Canada (AB)
said

Oh my poor fellow Canadians. Everybody bashes the Conservatives and they have no idea what they are talking about. Would you people please read the "Alberta Agenda" (by Harper and Flanagen) and "Harper's Team" (by Flanagen)? These papers and books are what the Conservatives are about. I can tell many of you haven't read them because of the things you complain about. At least if you read them you can say that you are making informed comments. And yes Harper has been living in Alberta for 30 years; we are the only province that is out of debt, we are the only province that has a savings account for rainy days, and at the same time we probably have the best infrastructure in Canada. Your all right though, why would you want that for your own province?


Embarassed Ontarian
said

McGuinty and Duncan must share the blame for this as part of their tax and spend policies that are not business friendly at all. If businesses have no incentive to set up in Ontario or to stay in Ontario, they will go where the economic climate is much more accommodating. McGuinty and Duncan will undoubtedly blame Harper and Flaherty for this embarassing mess, but as usual the media will not hold the Provincial Liberals responsible. The demise of Ontario has been in the works for years now. This is not something that just happened overnight. McGuinty is good for banning pit bulls, cell phones while driving and breaking promises. Vision is something he doesn't have.


Daisy1
said

No name calling from me..however, I call a "spade" a spade.

We as Canadians should be kept informed promptly and accurately as to what PM is contemplating before the fact instead of afterwards.

This government appears to be more of a "dictatorship"....with anyone representing us that we voted in sworn to not divulge anything whatsoever or they are booted out.


Seth in Calgary
said

"You give a man a fish and he will eat for a day, or you can teach a man to fish and he will eat everday" All you Ontario people want the Fed's to give you a fish and I'm sorry but a Conservative government will teach you to fish. ..

JP
said

Of course they will

its call BUY VOTES

we have had and will have the worst governmnet in years-
WATCH your WALLETS


AJP
said

To everyone bashing Ont: Did you even read this article? Its says quite clearly: "Ontario is the only province that has never received equalization payments. However, the province's economy has spent the last few years on a downward spiral thanks to depressed automotive and manufacturing sectors." Hello?!?!


Frank Buchan (Vauxhall, Alberta by way of Ontario)
said

I spent most of my life in Ontario (nearly 40 years) and left a couple years ago when I recognised Ontario was headed for an historical dead-end. Successive governments since the first term of David Peterson were piling on public servants, reacting instead of planning, and burying their heads in the sand -- evidently oblivious we were bleeding manufacturing to China.

To blame the Federal government (no matter what stripe), you have to ignore facts: Ontario has far too much government; far too high business taxes compared to other juridictions; and its manufacturing losses are systemic because of choices being made by consumers who are unwilling and often unable to pay excessive premiums just to proclaim something was made in Canada. (Like him or not, the Finance Minister was right about Ontario's business taxation policies.)

Dalton McGuinty is a weak-minded politician, whose stock-in-trade is tax-and-spend. That he and his cronies missed so many obvious signs the province needed a serious governmental overhaul is evidence of their detachment from reality.

Ontario does deserve transfer payments, though, if it needs them. The system can't punish a province just because it's poorly managed. The problem, as a former Ontarian, is that I don't see it helping much -- the government there is unlikely to manage the funds well. What happens when Dalton and company blow the cash without results? Does Ontario continue to decline? And at what point can the rest of the country offer suggestions? I query the last because I know for darn sure Ontario was full of advice the past 50 years prior to this one.


John E
said

...The equalization system go back to the Rowell-
Sirois Commission, which was established in response to the crop crisis of the Prairie provinces in the 1930s. It was then argued:
"In Canada today, freedom of movement and equality of opportunity are more
important than ever before, and these depend in part on the maintenance of at
least minimum national standards for education, public health and care of the
indigent. The most economically distressed areas are the ones least capable of supporting these services, and yet are also the ones in which the needs are likely to be greatest. Whether the remedy lies in emigration from these areas or in the development of alternative means of livelihood, they must not be allowed to become backwaters of illiteracy and disease. Not only national duty and decency,if Canada is to be a nation at all, but equity and national self-interest demand that the residents of these areas be given average services and equal opportunities.” This argument holds true today.
To date Ontario is the only Province not to collect equalization and that is about to change.


Yuri
said

Listen to them cry about Conservatives being a "hard times government." Quite simply "someone has to clean up the mess that the libs left" of course once that has been done I fully expect to see another liberal government. That is the way it has been since the beginning if confederation. "Libs mess up, Cons clean up"


Daisy1
said

Trust me John E...Ontario is incredibly needy.

The Big 3 and all it's supply companies are folding up and/or going bankrupt. Many, many jobs lost and no relief in sight.

Given the U.S. economy and how that affects the value of our dollar..I don't see anyone but the Chinese benefiting in the long haul. What we export is down dramatically.

Not good for the whole planet, really...this is not just affecting North America.


Donald - Ontario
said

This should not be a completely partisan issue. We need the Finance Ministers in each of the jurisdictions to look objectively at what is best for Canada, Ontario and all other provinces. The principles of equity, long-term financial health and good investment decisions should guide the decisions. This continual bickering about who is to blame, who's bad, doesn't help anyone.

It seems to me that too many people are viewing virtually all issues like this through a partisan prism which says that if they (pick your party) said it or did it then it's completely wrong (or completely right) and that is almost never the truth.


Rob in On
said

Thank you Eric (from Calgary) well said!!


Get Real People
said

Umm.. am I the only resident of Ontario who remembers Mike Harris' 8 years in office? He left McGuinty with a $5 billion deficit in '03 yet we blame the Liberals for this mess? Now I am no supporter of the current McGuinty government but come on.. stop trying to paint the Conservatives as great fiscal planners.


Daisy1
said

Thank you AJP - perhaps some will read your posting..eventually, the oil will dry up and we'll see all the wannabee Albertans moving back to their own provinces looking for work..again.

Let's hope by then, Ontario's economy improves so we ALL can work.


Mutt from Windsor
said

Thank God that the majority of Canadians voted for the Cons. There would have been no equalization money left if Dion had got in and imposed his Green Shaft. It's too bad that Duncan did not follow his counterparts in BC and lowered business taxes and created a business friendly environment in which to invest. The Liberal addiction to tax money has been the main cause of the loss of manufacturing jobs in my Ontario. When will the people in Ontario ever learn. You don't hire a social worker to fix an economic problem. Since the Cons are being tasked with bailing out provinces like Ontario, Flaherty should demand a common business tax rate for every Province and open up investment opportunies from coast to coast


JW
said

Having experienced living in other foreign countries, I now believe that in Canada, we have too many programs that are provincial which should be nationalized. In many European countries much larger than Canada's population, health care is nationalized, not provincialized, there is only one price for electricity and gas, and fuel for cars does not vary as much as it does in Canada (mainly due to local taxes and provincial taxes). We would not need an equalization program if most of the programs that these payments go to are nationalized. The premiers would not be grovelling over these funds if all federal taxes were spent to provide the national programs.


John W.
said

Ontario was doing well, then McGuinty comes into play, but doesn't get any blame, soo a provincial Gov. is budgeted completely by the Federal I don't think soo.

Yet another interesting story happens the world goes into a financial Crisis and Harper is to blame wao that’s allot of power in man to send the hole world into a financial melt down I bet that Harper can't sleep at night for that mess.

Common every one it takes 2 to tango Ontario had a surplus that Duncan as well as the Federal Gov. ate away it takes 2 to tango.



noel
said

Oil dry up in Alberta?Perhaps in a few hundred years!Do you people saying that even realize we have the second largest oil reserves in the world next to saudi arabia?I wont hold my breath waiting for it to dry up!


Nolan Moore
said

I think what we have to realize what started this whole financial crunch. Mainly stemed from US legislation which allowed and forced lenders to lend mortgages to "sub prime" borrowers. It started in 1978 and then changed in 1996. We see the increase in these "sub prime" lending starting in the mid 90's. The Fed would actually punish lenders who refused to lend to high risk borrowers. Some US senators and reps warned this would cause caos. Who was in power when this happened? The Democrats. We need to work on getting back to sound lending practices.


MRC in Hamilton
said

It's a sad day for Ontario. Thanks, McGuinty, you keep going to your under-the-rader Chinese meetings overseas now.


Don from Calgary
said

It's a problem that only a few provinces are now contributing to the pot. Albeta was not always a rich province, years ago we sacrificed a lot to be in as good shape as we are today. Albertans work extreamly hard and have been given zero respect from the rest of the country. Now we continue to hand over welth to poorer regions that simply will not budge their way of thinking. We fund provinces with massive governments, questionable social programs and even provinces with anti-Canadian agendas. Equalization only works if we can ensure that payments are not being flushed away. Provinces do not have an incentive to grow unless they are forced to. Hand outs are a bad idea and heaven help up the day when you hold your hand out to the west and we have nothing to give you.


5th Generation Canadian
said

Henry -- Mr. Harris, Mr. Flaherty and gang were responsible for the major demolition of Ontario during the "Common Sense Revolution" Bob Rae certainly had problems prior to that but he was small change when compared to the Tories!


Kelly
said

Equalization is a screwy program of shifting formulas and dubious side deals. I bet no more than 5 people in the entire country understands it fully and i bet none of them are politicians. The best we can hope for is for the Feds to lop a few heads from this Hydra and limit it's destructive power. The only "equalization" we have achieved is a poorer, less competitive Canada where some regions subsidize mediocrity in others.


Kevin in Toronto
said

In a country as vast as Canada it makes the most sense for most programs to be provincial jurisdiction.

Ontarians look at everything from a social perspective. There's this general belief that voting Conservative means that you're no longer socially progressive. Ontarians, particular Torontonians take this social progressiveness as their identity. This is what defines them, in their own mind, and makes them different from every other part of the country. People won't give it up easily. The sad part, is that it's all a facade. It makes Ontarians very short sighted. Based on the voting record of this province, people would rather see the fiscal and economic picture crumble than face the suggestion that they may conform with the majority of other Canadians.



ONT-AB resident
said

Anybody ever wonder why Quebec gets transfer payments; besides that they are a "distinct society" that want no part of being inside of Canada? How can a political party have a "Federal-party" status that does not even have a single representative/candidate outside of one province? I've always been stunned that they receive transfer payments ahead of Saskatchewan who still have farmers living below the poverty line. Instead of attacking Alberta or Ontario maybe we should be looking at where the money is going at present and re-evaluate/re-distribute that.


Liz Ottawa
said

if the govt of ontario would be more responsible about putting our tax dollars and that hated health tax to better use instead of voting themselves huge raises (when it is likely us federal silly servants will not get much of a salary increase, if any though most of us are currently without contracts), perhaps Ontario would not be in such a dire financial fix. Sometimes politicians make me sick. They promise promise and then take and take and just screw us. How the heck did Dalton McGuinty ever get back into office, I wonder that more than Mr Harper. What, voters wanted to see how far old Dalton would go to screw us more? I would love his lying face to just go away, everytime I see his face on TV I turn the channel. I get angry at him every time I do my taxes and see that I pay the same health tax premium as someone who makes 40k more than me. Something wrong with a dumb system like that, really really not fair at all. Fix it!


Living in Toronto- from NS
said

For all you Ontarians, Economic policy in this country has always been about Ontario, BOC interest rate moves were alwasy about supporting Ontario. I recall several times when interest rates went up to cool Ontario growth, just when the west or east needed them lowered, to spur growth for them. Just because Ontario doesn't get direct transfer payment doesn't mean Ontario didn't get its share..... how many billions have gone into the auto industry in Ontario????
Ontario has been treated well in confederation and will continue to be treated well.



PrairieDog-prairies
said

Ontario is getting their equalization. I don't have a problem with that, whatsoever. If they are entitled to it, then so be it.
Blaming Alberta (the west) and Conservatives for what is goin on in Ontario, however, is absurd. Even Manitoba, which has an NDP gov't, lowered taxes last year to be prepared for this. Blame your precious Liberal-tax and spend government for that. People want all these social programs, but don't realize that the money comes from their own pockets. But people are starting to wake up.
As far as oil running out in the west goes. That is simply a dream the far left has. Alberta has at least another 100-150 years in the oil sands alone. Saskatchewan has it's own "oil sands" that haven't even started to be tapped yet. It is expected to be bigger than Alberta's. Maniotba is now drilling more in the southern part of the province, and BC in the north. So, for all of you who say "the west will be a waste land" when the oil is gone...you may be waiting a very very very long time. In the mean time, we will be prospering and growing in all sectors...not just oil!


Paul B
said

You mean to tell me that Flaherty is FINALLY going to give money to us, Ontarians?

Guess this does make little amends, seeing that he messed up Ontario, leaving us with a 6 Billion Dollar Debt while he was the Finance Minister under the Conservative Premier of Ontario, Mike Harris.


Kris
said

Nice job McGuinty! Now we get to be a have-not province. Let's see if we can make it to dead last on the prosperity list!


RossD
said

Quebec a have not province to the tune of $8.35 billion? There is something seriously, seriously wrong with this picture folks!



Eric (from Calgary)
said

8.35 billion for Quebec! 347 million for Ontario. 2.1 billion for Manitoba. 347 million for Ontario. 1.69 billion for New Brunswick. 347 million for Ontario. 1.57 billion for Nova Scotia. 347 million for Ontario. Ontario contributes 11 billion to equalization which almost of of the equalization payments combined. Even those of us in the West surely see that this is not equal.


edd
said

To Eric from Calgary:

The population of Ontario is very close to 12 million, the population of Canada is 33 million. I don't see Ontario having the majority of the population.


James in BC
said

OMG, Quebec gets $8.35 billion in equaliztion payments? They are sucking this program dry. Yet at the same time they want to separate? Am I the only one who is shaking their head on this?

Let them separate, we'll build a bridge to the East coast, it would be cheaper, probably create a lot of jobs too.


defsask
said

There seems to be a lot of huffing and puffing about Ontario. What about Quebec and the billions of equalization dollars being sent their way? Can anyone explain why one province can be receiving such an obscene amount of money?


George
said

I find it hard to believe that Quebec is still a have not province. With its size and richness in natural resources not to mention aerospace and other transport industries, universities and a rather large educated and business mined populace; why is it so poor? Anyone care to try on this one?


RJ
said

equalization payment. What a joke!!! 8 plus million to a province that is a distinct Society. I guess its easy being distict when you dont have to pay for it!! how are there payments so much more than everybody else? Is this money needed or just to make it par with what the other provinces made?


Liz Ottawa
said

One thing I dont get is why does Quebec get 8.3 billion? Oh thats right I forgot they have to finance their separation from us. lol What is wrong with this picture, is it only myself who has a problem with that?


Jay, Ottawa
said

noel said, "Oil dry up in Alberta?Perhaps in a few hundred years!"

The oil won't dry up, but the market will when technology moves us away from petroleum fuels. This could happen within a generation at the rate of investment in alternative energy. This will drive the price down to next to nothing. What then?


Matt in Ottawa
said

All those "west is best" people really need to wake up and smell the roses,

At one point Quebec was the center of Canada, we all know what happened there, Along came Ontario with Toronto as the hub of the Canadian economy. If all you people in Alberta think its easy being the life support for an entire country its not.

I am sick and tired to hearing people in Alberta saying how that province is the best place to be.. OIL will not last for ever and other then that whats driving your economy? the ski industry? farming? I think not.

I also think its really funny that Quebec, a province with half the population of Ontario gets 8 billion of Canada's tax dollars to do what? denounce the gift giver? Give me a break. At least in Ontario that money is used to build bridges that don't fall down and maintain roads.




Trevor - Calgary
said

It's time for the staunch liberal supports to do some deep soul searching. The BIGGEST problem this country ever faced was having the liberal governments in power for so long at both the Federal and Provincial levels in the now down trodden provinces.

It all seemed really good when the liberals took advantage of the rest of the county to ensure that Ontario was happy and for the most part kept in the dark to ensure that they would keep "votin em back in!!"

Well times have changed and the ONLY provinces that are doing well are those that had a strong economic plan in place and kept with that plan. And guess what.. they are the conservative provinces.

The conservatives are in power now and you will find that working with them rather than against them will lead to a strong, healthy, secure country.

Tell your local vocal liberal supporter to stop being the problem and start being part of the solution.


Bob
said

ONT-AB resident, hit it on the dot.

People shouldn't be dissing AB or ON. If anything they should be praising AB, SK and BC for 'donating' 13.6 billion dollars to the rest of Quebec...err I mean Canada.

The real message or what we SHOULD be asking is why does Quebec get 8.4 BILLION dollars in equalization payments? They want independence, give them independence. Of course without being attached to Ottawa's wallet.



Fraser
said

It's so nice to see that the partisan politics are still alive and well in the comments here.

Interesting how Prime Minister Harper and his Conservative government have done such damage in the less than 3 years of governing. What a powerful bunch I'd say. To have so much power attributed to a group is absolutely amazing.

Does anyone really think before they post such comments or is it from the constant barrage of media hype that we endure on a daily basis that confounds the intelligence of all concerned? [end sarcasm]



opinion
said

All of you who have a problem with TO getting some help can K*** my *** For years Ontario has shared its wealth with the rest of Canada, Payback is a b***h.
Ontario wants B Obama in the USA yet we vote in this Con so he can be our Finance Minister for this selfrighteous Government, how stupid.


Liz Ottawa
said

Eric from Calgary why not ask yourself why Que has less of a pop than Ont and gets 8.3 million over the piddling 347 M that Ont is getting. This is clearly a political move to buy votes from Quebec and nothing else. I am sick of giving giving giving to Quebec and having them keep threatening to separate. So leave already, we will figure things out probably better without all the whining from your never satisfied little camp. And maybge that 8.3 billion can be generously partioned among the other provs that still believe in Canada. Scary to think of what would happen if the rest of the provs held a referendum to vote on Quebec separating. I have a pretty good idea what the vote would be. Bye bye Quebec. Sadly we dont get to vote in it, they only get to have their crooked little vote without us. I still think that last referendum was not as close as the media made out.


Lunt
said

8.35 billion for QB.....what a joke that is...... vote OUI next time please


Eric (from Calgary)
said

Hey Edd:
12.5 B in Ontario
7.5 B in Quebec
4.5 B in BC
3.5 B in Alberta
1.2 B in Manitoba

The largest majority of Canadians live in Ontario, a full third of the countries population. When we attack Ontario we are in fact attacking the largest majority of Canadians.



Garry
said

The biggest problem with the amount Quebec receives in equalization is that they have social programs that cannot be supported in other regions due to the cost. In Quebec they don't have to worry because someone else is picking up the tab.
Writing this probably makes me a bigot in Canada. What a country.


Denise
said

Have any of you looked at the $ amounts the "have not" provinces receive? Ontario's is pocket change compared to Quebec's $8 BILLION yearly haul. Quebec - the province represented by a party devoted to LEAVING Canada - receives BILLIONS of dollars a year from the rest of us in order to pay for their socialist programs when they don't even want to be a part of Canada. What kind of lunacy is that? Or is that the "bribe" money to keep them in confederation and thereby maintain an Eastern power base?


CC
said

There is no justification in Quebec getting 8 billion dollars. That is nothing more than to keep the seperatists happy. Stop giving them a penny and maybe we will have them finally seperate. I'm sick of the west feeding their 'arts". Ontario has given it's share and received a lot. But if they need help at this time so be it. But enough for Quebec already!


Jana
said

Why does Quebec get eight billion dollars?? Guess when the Liberals were in power, they were in the right province to receive the largest equilization payments. Is this fair????
NO! Mr. Flaherty go home!



Thanks Canada
said

How sad I feel, seeing my once mighty province fall to have-not status. This is a sad day for us all. Thank goodness there are other provinces willing to help us out in our time of need. This is what makes Canada great. Thanks to AB SK NFLD and BC for carry us through this difficult time.


BC and the West Should Help Out
said

Flaherty badmouthed Ontario and told the world not to invest there; now he is still neglecting the Province by not assisting the engine of our Country, the manufacturing sector - note the oil sectors out West get lots of Federal government assistance through massive tax benefits.

I remember visiting Ontario and saw what Flaherty, Baird and Clement did to Ontario when they were in the Conservative Party Government of Premier Mike Harris. That Province came to a complete halt under their mismanagement. Now Ontario is trying to catch up to the deteriorating infrastructure left behind by the Conservatives when they were in power in Ontario.

As a BC'er I'd be more than pleased to share the wealth of our gas and other resources with Ontario and other parts of Canada that need help. Alberta should willingly do the same. We are one family and I for one am tired of conservative Albertans bathmouthing other parts of Canada such as Ontario and Quebec.


HL
said

HL from NL
I guess they wiped their hands of Newfoundland. They didn't mention NL being one of the provinces receiving or not receiving equalization payments. Maybe they have wiped us off the map. I think Ontario should receive payments until their manufacturing economy can rise. They are part of Canada too - however we did not vote for Harper.


jim
said

Please do not ask for more help to the Automotive... sorry...Auto Assembly industry.

From CTV "Detroit-based auto maker said Monday that it sold nearly 169,000 light vehicles, down from about 307,000 in the same month last year."

People have no money to buy car, therefore no more assembly line needed. Nothing to do with the government or BC or Alberta. Now oil price drops too, the remaining oil & gas related manufacturing jobs in Ontario would go as well.




JAMES
said

Does this mean my property taxes are going down?............oh wait the TTC, CUPE and OPSEU will find ways to vacuum up this money and leave us regulars paying for them

Forgot I was living in Ontario


Kevin D - Calgary
said

A couple of items, Kim, yes most albertans are benefiting from the oil industry without working in the oil industry. With such low unemployment service based companies are paying large dollars for front line service jobs. Where else do you see counter staff at donut stores making $15 an hour, Superstore is advertising for part time staff starting at $15 an hour and full time at $17 plus full benefits. Secondly does anyone else notice that Quebec takes in more than 60% of the equalization payments? The income that Quebec makes from the Hydro program that Newfoundland paid for does not enter the equalization formula. This is billions per year. That needs to get fixed immediately and then maybe the feds won't have to cap this program. Third, it's ridiculous to have a set 15% annual increase in this program when inflation is abuot 2-3%.


Dd
said

And Newfoundland will be a Have province next year...so no more whining from Ontario about supporting us. Now we're supporting YOU!


David
said

It is interesting to read about how Mike Harris ruined Ontario. It is pretty easy to understand the viewpoint of those who make that complaint. I did and still do support Harris and Flaherty. They saved Ontario by making it less costly and putting responsibility where it lies - with individuals. Welfare was intended as a short term relief program, not multi-generational income. People need to take more responsibility for their own actions and rely less on government so government can become smaller. Ontario needs help because McGuinty can't make difficult decisions, such as cuts to programs and services. If he got elected to be popular, he picked the wrong job.
I am an Ontarian and don't understand why we would expect federal dollars for our infrastructure. Why should Albertans pay for a subway in Toronto?
I was raised to believe that if you can't afford something, you don't buy it. We should all try to live like that.


Maureen
said

The whole equalization scheme should be abandoned - it has allowed (and supported) provinces to continue doing what doesn't work because other provinces were forced to pick up the tab. Time to put equalization programs to bed and hope they never rise again. All provinces have various natural resources and other strengths that they should focus on rather than depend on other provinces to fork over money.


Linda in Vancouver
said

I agree with a lot of what "Mike in Ottawa" said about the divisions within Canada.But I don't think the whiners on here have as much trouble with equalization as they do with a gnerals sense that Canada is no longer a nation, but is now a collection of provinces and territories competing against each other.
In eastern and central Canada,the issue of massive unre representation for the west may not even be on the radar screen.Nor is the Senate.I have absolutely no issue with any province getting equalization during tough times.But,surely the price for that should include fair and proper voices for ALL provinces in botth the Senate and in Parliament.
I do not resent anything about Ontario getting a fair shake.I do,howewver,very much resent their opposition to Senate reform,and the notion that they should be able to dictate to the entire country.
Equalization has been a difficult issue for all parties in power,for a very long time.When was the last time all of our premiers agreed on anything?? And all the time the feds are busy trying to play referee while provinces get into spitting contests about how to divy up a finite number of taxpayer dollars.
How do we reconcile the differences when one part of the country is conservative in it's ideology,and another is either liberal,or even socialist?? Neither should be denied,but they should also not be able to impose their views on a province with genuinely different views.
If we are supposed to be tolerant to minorities,why is it we cannot be tolerant to other regions of our own country??
I am as Canadian as anyone in Ontario.But I will fight to the end to preserve western values and lifestyles.


Former Ontarian
said

To all these people that think everyone moves to Alberta because of the oil, you need a quick lesson.

I moved here from Toronto (born and raised there) 3.5 years ago with my family.

Contrary to popular belief the whole province doesn't work in oil.

Certainly the province is financially healthy and enjoys benefits like no PST and 'Ralph Bucks' etc., for which everyone here can thank the oil revenues.

But the real reason I moved out here is because I was fed up with Ontario, Toronto was too big and only getting worse and frankly the people out here are simply nicer!!!

It's all about quality of life, and there's nothing in the GTA that can offer what I have out here.


M. Cameron
said

Why, Mr. Flaherty, that's very liberal spending there.


kari
said

Response to Don from Calgary: beautifully said...


Doug in Calgary
said

I live in Alberta and when the oil boom was over in the 80's we never got a hand out here from the Liberals. We have no debt here and that has come from the good times and bad but we have paid off everything and actually have a surplus. If all of a sudden poor ontario is getting a hand out, what about the 3 prairie provinces who are paying for it. Why is the west paying for the eastern provinces and get nothing from them especially Ontario. Thats their own faults for voting Liberal and NDP in the past if they have no money for the rainy days.


Paul
said

As a Canadian who happens to be from Quebec I am sick and tired of people in the West painting us all with the same brush.. we do not ALL want to separate if fact a clear majority of us voted twice not to. Reading the comments here it is no wonder that many people in Quebec feel unwelcome in this great country of ours.. its enough to make even me, a staunch federalist wonder about sharing a country with such intolerant people as many of those posting messages here. Before the West struck oil, Quebec and Ontario were paying for it and now that things have changed and manufacturing jobs are disapearing in the East due to global economic conjecture we have to decide as CANADIANS whether we want to stick together or adopt a selfish and self-defeating attitude. Ultimately, the future of our country depends on it. Let's face it.. Canada without ANY of its provinces would not be the same. I have trouble believing people who say they are proud to be Canadian but who seem just as determined to tear the country apart as Pauline Marois.. food for thought.


marcel
said

To Noel, I don't agree with your statement that Ontario is whining. The government and the people of our beautiful province, just wants to receive its fair share. As far as I know, it is first time in it's fifty year of existence, that Ontario will be receiving equalization.


Agent001
said

Ontario's got the money now. Will Premier McGuinty make good use of it to get Ontarians out of the hole? It is, after all, a solemn warning to Ontarians who pride themselves of being one of the major "economic engines" of Canada...


Larry NL
said

Frank Buchan and Seth
Frank
I too left Ontario after living there for 63 years and I could see that the automotive industry was going to bringing the province to it's knees and there wasn't a safety net when it happens. Nothing to fall back on for employment.

Seth, the old adage that you quoted is very true about teaching the village how to fish, and that is what Ottawa is trying to do by supporting new innovative and technical ideas make cars that are using less gasoline or an alternative fuel. The country and the province to come up with this new industry will be the winner not the one that sits back and waits for handouts.
Mr. McGuinty has been taking hand outs for many years. When he can't squeeze anymore from the tax paying Ontarions, he goes after Ottawa and blames Canada for his own governments follies.


james
said

I'm wondering if there is a possibility of adding up ALL the money Quebec and the Maritimes get from the federal government (equalization, economic stimulus, investment, defence contracts, civil servants/military personnel employed there, etc). Indeed, why not look at the total federal package to each province and work it out the per capita amount. Then compare that to the per capita contribution in federal tax dollars to each province.

Then we would all know which of these provincial politicians is lying.


Jack - AB
said

Thank you Ontario for providing Canada with equalization payments ALL of the previous years - unfortunately most of your money ended up in Quebec. Sorry to say that Ontarions, with the largest provincial population, will get one of the lowest payouts compared to other provices getting money. You can tell that the system is not fair.

How do we justify giving Quebec $8.35B? Around 50-55% of the equalization payments are going to Quebec. I just can't believe what is going on here. Talk about insanity. Hey Ontario, you guys are basically paying to subsidize Quebec and their socialist spending. $347M is nothing for Ontario - pocket change. Taking Quebec down to $5B so that Ontario can get a few Billion makes greater sense.


JRH
said

I read a story about Quebec in Maclean's magazine that made me sick. I can't remember the exact stats, but there are two major problems that are stopping Quebec from prospering. 1) The province has a long history of bloated social programs. I don't remember which ones cost the province the most, but there are way more of those programs in Quebec than other provinces. 2) The labour unions are absolutely killing Quebec's economy and stifling growth. A provinicial leader tried to reform the labour system and got quashed quickly by these powerful unions. Think about it; if most people are under a union and are paid more than market value, how can an economy be competitive? I am not writing this as hate-mongering toward Quebec, but the other studies in the article stated that on average, Quebecers sleep more and work less than any other province in Canada. Who can blame them? If I had a)a guaranteed job with b)an inflated pay rate, and c)social progams to catch me if I lost my job, I think I would slack too. It is a system that cannot prosper. Hence the $8 billion plus that is going to Quebec this January.


joey
said

To Marcel

Ontario has gotten its fair share when the dollar was low. Ontario was doing good at the expense of the rest of Canada.

Good Manufacturing Industry = Ontario is goind good.

Good Oil and Resource Industry = BC, AB, Sask, Nova Scotia, Newfoundland are doing well.

Which way is better?


Richard L. Provencher
said

Hi folks, It's time to work together. We need everyone to support each other and be thankful we have a government willing to do what is right for everyone. Of course, the Conservatives won't satisfy everyone. Not possible. We have a great country. Let's work on this - together.


Mike from Ontario
said

I am sick of reading all these posts from people in Alberta having a hate on for Ontario and think it is finished in these economic times. Sure you out there have the oil NOW and are all in your glory, but once its gone, then what? As they say, money doesn't grow on trees, and FYI it can't be mined out of the ground either.


Anne
said

Many of these comments complain about bailing out Ontario. You can thank those in western Canada as this area of the country voted a clean CON sweep. So your welcome! ...not watch how the provincial government in Alberta goes back to the deep cuts that we had to live through in the 90's. Maybe Ontario can do the same?


DANIEL H
said

Does anyone know how they calculate these numbers for what each province gets?


Angry Liberal
said

Before the election, our economy is sound...

After the election,
equalization.

Good job Tories


Get real people - Thornhill
said

For all of you that like to say Flatherty left Ontario with a 6 Billion deficit, I would like to remind you that that was a number the Liberals reported. And we all know Dalton and gang to be honest now dont we. Every government blames the last and every government says the last one lied. I just don't understand you people that still believe McGuinty. All he does is lie so why trust him on the 6 Billion number. As long as Ontario keeps its head in the sand we will be in trouble.


Oba
said

When we are talking about Oil & Gas, let don't forget they don't just pump the oil out with a fish tank cleaning tube.

They need lots of equipments, pipes, vehicles, etc etc to get things going. The oil & gas company pay huge $$$$ for these equipments, much more than people pay for the cars in Windsor. The oil and gas industry benefits Ontario's manufacturing industry big time. It benefits the truckers who ship the equipments from ON to AB as well.

Another thing, the east-west division was initiated in the east first as in the past 5 decades, all policies in Ottawa favours Ontario and the Maritime. When the west starts to do well, the central wants to get a "fair share."

Ontario should stop complaining. Alberta increase all health care, tuition by 100% before the oil boom to pay off the provincial debt, AB didn't ask Ottawa to bail them out after the recession caused by the National Energy Program. AB deserves the boom and the luck. Ontario should follow with tight spending and start paying off the debt.


bob
said

Quebec gets $8.35 Billion? How can a province that has minerals, mining, forrestry, pulp and and paper,aviation, hydro electric, be a have not?


RAV
said

The purpose of the Equalization Program, Canada Health Transfer (CHT) and the Canada Social Transfer (CST) is to allow provinces to provide comparable levels of social services at comparable levels of taxation. Something is seriously wrong when provinces with the highest rates of taxation and greatest population are receiving benefits from those with the lowest rates and smaller populations. If those provinces with high taxation rates were to reduce those rates then perhaps they would create the necessary incentives to make improvements to their own economies and become a have province.


al from calgary
said

I am one Albertan who has no problem with Ont getting payments, but I do have a problem with Quebec getting 8.3 billion so they can have their 7 dollar a day daycare that the rest of Canada is paying for. As I've said many times on this posting, let them go with their share of the debt and no more money from the ROC and they will be back begging us to get back into Canada when they have no money for their beloved social programs. I'd rather see that money go to education or health care than to pet social projects that the rest of Canada can't afford. How much would Ontario get if they wanted 7 dollar a day daycare subsidized by the rest on Canada "just a scary thought"


Billy Westerner
said

At least Ontario is not burning the rest of Canada for 8.35 Billion like Quebec...thats unbelievable and to think they want to seperate...I'm not sure the people of Quebec would agree to have there taxes increased by 8.35 Billion just so they can go it alone.


Kim in Calgary
said

To Kevin D in Calgary....I just picked up some bread and milk at the Superstore in my area...when I mentioned your starting salaries, three or four of the clerks asked me which location paid those wages...please let us know..besides a $15 dollar an hour wage wouldn't cover my mortgage payment and gas price at the pumps here...




edd
said

To Eric in Calgary:

A majority is still greater than 50%, which 12 million isn't.

And I'm also assuming when you listed the totals for the various provinces you meant million not billion.


DCR-Toronto
said

There was a time when the people were actually "proud" to not have to collect equalization. To see people saying that they want more, shows where we have come as a province and a country. It's very sad to see that a hand out has become better than having prosperity. No province should look forward to collecting this money. They should be more worried about the future of the province and how we , as a whole, can make it better. My worry is that McGuinty will take this money and pump it into programs that are doomed to fail. All of us in the east should be happy to have our western brothers to help us.


Cal in Ottawa
said

Just goes to show what a great job Mr McGuinty and his finance minister have done. Even after McGuinty lied to us after he was elected the first time, the people of Ontario elected him again. Now we are a have not province... incredible. If it wasn't so sad it would be amusing to listen to Mr Duncan saying the federal gov't has to forget ideology, when he is following a socialist leaning ideology himself. If you make your prov unattractive to business, it will find greener pastures. The decline in the potential for manufacturing has been evident for a long time, it will not be coming back. Green tech is a potential growth area we must pursue with vigour and haste; but don't hold your breathe. The premier says we will recover from this have not status, but unless he is willing to shift his economic stance, it is difficult to see how. I do not see any plan to achieve this, and faith won't cut it.


Randy
said

Perhaps now Ontario, and the self appointed "Canadian Intelligencia" living in Toronto, will come out of the geocentric bubble they have been living in and realize their provincial leadership and government is inept. Sadly, I doubt the message will resonate thru most of the thick heads living there, and blogging here.


Rick in Calgary
said

Here is the problem with the equalization payments. The services that are being provided by the "Have Not Provinces" such as Quebec's $7 a day daycare are not available in the "Have Provinces". This is a problem because if the "Have Provinces" had the same level of services as Quebec, the confederation would be bankrupt. These equalization payments where created to ensure everyone in Canada had roads, hospitals, a respectable level of social services and opportunity to make changes to deal with things that brought hard times to region. What the payments have become now is welfare for Quebec and the Maritimes. This is changing in NL, now that they have oil, but the last election and the ABC campaign shows Alberta, BC, Sask and Ont that the "Have Not's" are not going to give up the easy money without a fight. Maybe the GTA will get tired of being poor, because they are sending 8 billion to Quebec, and vote conservative next time.


Bee
said

Great. The McGuinty Liberals now have Ontario receiving welfare payments from the feds. McGuinty is so busy banning everything to draw attention away from the real issues in Ontario.


Brian AB
said

Paul( Canada needs Quebec)

I agree with what you said but i believe the biggest problem that the west has with quebec is the fact when it comes to a election time why is there a party from quebec in the election?

That is a provincal party it has no place when it comes to the rest of canada thats the only problem i have with quebec.
I feel quebec is an important part of canada but you should have to vote on the same parties as the rest of us.



Richard V
said

The equalization payments will begin in January. Other provinces receiving payments are: Good NDP and Liberal governments, and their supporters continue to vote for the same old losers. Laughter not sympathy from me.



Edmonton John
said

I read on one of the posts that Alberta was doing well because it voted Conservative and had a plan for the future.

What a total freaking joke!!!

We are still recovering from the ineptitude of King Ralph who disclosed as he left office that he had at no time EVER formulated a plan for economic growth and development.

Even Ralph could run a surplus out here, for crying out loud, so don't boast about management and judgement.

Please, fellow Albertans, like most Conservatives you are quick to ask others to 'get over it'. Well, now that applies to your pathological hatred of all things Liberal, and the East in general.

We are one country, and it all belongs to all of us. We need to work together to make this the best place on our poor tortured planet, for all Canadians. There's no room for the kind of poison spat out on this discussion board.


Michael (Ottawa South)
said

I wish to extend congratulations to all Ontarians who voted for Dalton McGuinty and his team for this unique distinction.

As an Ontarian who did NOT vote for Dalton McGuinty I can assure you this is a shameful occurrence in large part to the poor management of our Ontario economy which has been struggling even before this recent financial crisis.



Stuart Graham
said

Can someone please explain to me why Quebec, rich in Hydroelectric power, and threatens separation at every turn, receives 59% of Canadian taxpayer's hard earned cash? How does this formula called Equalization work because from where I sit, it does not sound very equal.


John E
said

Is it now time for Ontario to start whining like Alberta has for the past thirty years. Ontario still contributes the lions share to the federal coffers, as long as that continues Canada will be okay. However, if Ontario's GDP falls too low and fed income tax drops all Canada will suffer. I think Ontario will basically have to get out of this slump by itself. We did it three times before when the feds clawed back the equalization Ontario was owed and we can do it again. Unlike Alberta that needed a lot of outside help and a lot of luck, Ontario will have to work hard and sacrifice.


JOHN
said

In the 1950s and 1960s, oil had been found in Alberta. However, the federal govt kept the price of gasoline higher in Ontario because the federal government’s National Petroleum Policy which restricted the importation of cheaper foreign oil, as a way of encouraging the
development of Alberta’s petro-chemical industry. This was done at a great financial cost to the Ontario people and Ontario industry not to be able to import cheaper foreign. At the National Research Council, research on extracting oil from the Athabaska Tar Sands was financed by all of
Canada’s taxpayers not just Alerta – and from 1957 to 1965 Alberta was a recipient of equalization payments.
By the 1980s, Albertans
had largely forgotten both past poverty and past assistance and a constant whine was now heard from the West. BC never really complained nor did the other Western Provinced, just oil rich Alberta. Why is that?


Michael (Ottawa)
said

"I don't think the whiners on here have as much trouble with equalization as they do with a general sense that Canada is no longer a nation, but is now a collection of provinces and territories competing against each other"

Well when you have a Liberal party that caters to Toronto and Quebec and has NO REPRESENTATION outside of regional concentrations its little wonder the country has a distorted sense of identity. Fortunately under the Conservatives we have a new government which has representations across the entire nation which will help.





jabrod
said

This is a sad day for Ontario. It is not the fault of any political party but rather it is just the way it goes. Ontario will bounce back eventually but for now it is their turn to be the Newfy Joke.


Jack
said

I think equalization payments are absolutely neccesary. Any province who needs help to provide equal services in health and education deserve it. What some Klein brainwashed westerners seem to forget is Alberta was looked after by the east not all that long ago. As far as I'm concerned, the east is carrying Alberta now with a great resouce of labour. Now the east seems to be coming around and will start contributing to the next province who need it. That's what makes this country so great. We look out for each other. I think we should think more on the side of nationalism instead of all this my province is best BS.


DHay
said

Let's talk about the provincial Liberals record. They keep pointing the finger outside their camp in an effort to get the attention off the fact they have bungled the provinces economy and books.

If only there was a viable opposition to take them out...


wilbil
said

Right as rain.....the whole world voted Conservative.

BTW, for those who don't know, Flaherty was elected again.

Must be doing something right! or is it the other way round?

Any way Mr Harper knows a good finance minister when he sees one like so many voters.

BW


Drew in NS
said

The Newfie joke lives as long as Danny Williams is Premier!

If the people living in Nfld want any credibility in wanting this country to move ahead, they have got to vote for moving Canada forward instead of Danny Williams ego!

I have more respect for the people in Quebec who voted for the Bloc than the past elections cry baby premiers option.

NFLD may be a have province but a shame to Atlantic Canada


Lisa
said

I'm thinking the 5 billion dollar deficit left by the previous Eves/Harris Government in Ontario probably didn't help their current situation.


Brian
said

Ontario's manufacturing industry has been getting billions of dollars for decades now, so if you want to talk give and take make sure you include all the factors in the math.

The Conservatives have only been in power for 2 1/2 years, those blaming them for all the problems simply refuse to accept the reality, open your eyes because your only fooling yourself.

Ontario has certainly given money to the rest of Canada but most of that would never have been possible without federal investment.

Suck it up and look for new ways to improve the future.


Walter (Wpg.)
said

It's time for us all to help Ontario at this time, we'd been living off their prosperity long enough.
Alberta better be carefull with all those pipelines running into the U.S. with raw crued- they may be in the same situation as Ontario soon, there's only so much oil in the ground.


John Power
said

Let's see Central Canadians try to tell a 'Newfie' joke now. Rest assured that Newfoundlanders will not be so condescending and patronizing in our attitudes towards Ontario's economic difficulties as many Canadians often were to ours. It is beneath us, quite frankly, and we will stand by our sister provinces in their time of need.


Adrian (Vancouver)
said

Baby boomers, your days are numbered. Do what you can now while you have your strength in numbers. But I'm holding my breath until my progressive, LIBERAL (in the true, non-partisan meaning of the damn word) generation get's to fix what you all are continuously screwing up.

This is not a Conservative, Liberal, or NDP problem...THIS IS A GENERATIONAL PROBLEM. Your generation's tired and archaic policies can't dry up soon enough. It's simply pathetic and embarrassing to watch.

Smarten up...you're supposed to be ROLE-MODELS for Pete's sake, and the only thing you're providing is a Model-T with flat tires.


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