CTV News | TSX plummets 840.93 points, worst drop in 8 years

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TSX plummets 840.93 points, worst drop in 8 years

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CTV News: Lisa Laflamme on Canada's reaction
CTV National News: Robert Fife reports on the impact of the financial crisis on the Canadian election campaign
CTV National News: Tom Kennedy reports on the fallen U.S economy and its chain reaction overseas
CTV Toronto: Correspondents on the market dive
CTV Toronto: Paul Bliss speaks with the Ontario finance minister, who suggests things are going to get worse before they get better
CTV Toronto: Naomi Parness on the city's plan to raise money, as global markets suffer an crisis
CTV Newsnet: BNN's Amanda Lang looks at how the already-volatile markets will be affected
CTV News: BNN's Michael Hainsworth on the best plan of action for the average Canadian
CTV Newsnet: Vinny Catalano, president, Blue Marble Research, on the line from N.Y., explains what parts of the plan were contentious
CTV Newsnet: Patricia Croft, chief economist, Phillips, Hagar, and North Investment Management, on what the markets may do on Tuesday
CTV Newsnet: Craig Alexander, vice president and deputy chief economist TD Bank Financial Group, says a failed bill to bailout the fledgling American economy has caused chaotic ripple effects in markets worldwide, but Canadian banks says they remain stable and confident
CTV Newsnet: Graham Richardson on Stephen Harper's final decision on an meeting

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CTV.ca News Staff

Date: Mon. Sep. 29 2008 8:51 PM ET

Canada's TSX tumbled more than 840 points after the U.S. Congress defeated a bailout plan for the financial sector Monday, and NDP Leader Jack Layton called for an all-party meeting to address the situation.

Toronto's S&P/TSX index was down 840.93 points to 11,285.07 in afternoon trading Monday, its biggest drop in nearly eight years.

Don Drummond, Chief Economist at TD Bank, told CTV's Mike Duffy Live on Monday that Canada, like many other nations, is feeling the credit crunch that has hit the U.S.

He said credit is flowing more freely here in Canada than in the U.S. but the cost of credit has gone up.

"If you've got 'bank' in your title I don't care what country in the world you're at, you are feeling this impact, just not quite as heavily as in the United States," said Drummond.

New York's Dow Jones industrial average lost 777.68 points to 10,365.45 -- its biggest point-loss in history. The Nasdaq composite index fell 199.61 points to 1,983.73 and the S&P 500 lost 106.85 to end the day at 1,106.42.

Also Monday, the Federal Reserve, the Bank of Canada and other central banks took further action to help reverse the credit crisis.

The Bank of Canada said it, along with the Federal Reserve, have agreed to expand their reciprocal currency arrangement to US$30 billion -- a jump from the US$10 billion announced Sept. 18.

Economy politics

Following the rejection of the bailout in the U.S., NDP Leader Jack Layton called for an all-party meeting because it could result in agreement on "points of common action, and perhaps an appropriate common statement."

"Our first and essential concern must to make sure that the savings, pensions, homes and jobs of ordinary working families are safe and secure," Layton told reporters.

A spokesperson for Conservative Leader Stephen Harper said there would be no such meeting and that the proper place for this kind of discussion would be the upcoming federal debates.

The NDP's Paul Dewar told CTV's Mike Duffy Live on Monday that he hopes that Harper reconsiders a meeting between all party leaders, the governor of the Bank of Canada and the deputy minister of finance to assess the situation and look for solutions.

"We've seen in the United States there has been a reach across the aisle amongst parties to look at the crisis that faces not just government, not just markets, but everyday people," said Dewar.

Conservative candidate Ted Menzies said Canadian banks are in good shape because of Stephen Harper's leadership, and there's no reason to bring in other leaders for advice.

"If he's going to bring in Jack Layton and Stephane Dion, both of whom have pretty substantially suggested they want to drive us into a recession, perhaps we don't need that sort of financial advice right now," said Menzies.

Liberal John McCallum also dismissed the suggested meeting and characterized it as "posturing" on the part of the Layton.

"The fact that (Layton) would have a $50 billion tax grab of corporate income tax, thereby killing jobs of all those people around the kitchen table suggests to me he doesn't understand economics, so I'm not sure what Jack could contribute," McCallum said.

Liberal Leader Stephane Dion released a statement on the financial fallout, saying he was "extremely concerned about the effect today's events will have on our economy and the savings of ordinary Canadians."

The statement went on to say previous Liberal governments had a type of "rainy-day" fund to deal with sudden downturns in the economy.

"That is why under Jean Chrétien and Paul Martin, Liberal governments committed to sound fiscal management, the cornerstone of which was maintaining a $3-billion contingency fund," read the statement. "A new Liberal government will return to this practice -- a prudent measure irresponsibly abandoned by the Conservative government."

The statement echoed what former Liberal prime minister Paul Martin said earlier in the day at an Economic Club of Canada meeting, that governments should stay in surplus as it's the best was to fend off a deficit.

"What you've got to do is prepare yourself for it. What does that mean? Well, it really means that you don't say, 'We're running a surplus and what a terrible thing this is' and wipe it out," Martin said.

"You say to yourself, 'You know what I'm running the surplus for, I'm running the surplus so that if I don't need it I can pay down debt, or invest in infrastructure but if I do need it I can provide the country with the temporary respite for the country to get through it.'"

Comments are now closed for this story

Al from Winnipeg
said

Do some investing today folks (the market is a purely emotional and irrational beast).With this uncertainty, there will be some great deals out there today.


Robin the Hood
said

Tic Tock, Tic Tock... the bell may be sounding for the American economic empire.. I see the so called "Democratic Capitalism" (not very democratic, really), referred to by Bush in his bail out speech last week, ideology give way to the rise of socialized capitalism (assuming there is an economy left after the dust settles.. in about 5 years). Finally perhaps the common person will finally get their economy back!? It was the lack of regulation - a corner stone of right wing idealogy - that led to this disaster. Now even Republicans are forced to vote in favour of a bail-out and more regulation.. nice to see these pigs eat their own arrogance... and the meal on the menu is called humble pie!
What concerns me is that the right wing agenda may have caused more irreparable damage than even I had feared possible. I fear the spillover into Canada. I now pray it won't be as bad as its looking now and that the right wing and all their brainless minions will be put back in their place .. the dustbin of history!



Ms. L.
said

I thought Harper said the economy was sound and that Canada would be okay.


Garry in NS
said

No Canadian Government - regardless of which party is in power - can control what happens to the Canadian economy as a consequence of actions in the Stock Market. Our Government cannot control what happens in Hong Kong, Tokyo, Paris, London, etc. To blame the Conservatives for any resultant economic downturn in our economy is extremely naive - almost to the point of being stupid!


Greg G from Cobourg,ON
said

This is a prime example how those who live within their means and watch how the spend and save when they can, have to suffer by the cause of those who do not.


Vince m
said

Apart from what you lefties think Harper does not control the price of oil (that would be more of a Jack Leyton thing). The TSX is weighted heavy with resource stocks. Oil goes down, oil company stock price goes down, TSX goes down.




Shane
said

As I watched the US House of Reps vote on the bailout, the DOW hit -670 or so. It isn't looking very good down South right now.


Vince M
said

Hey Robin the Hood... if you think Capitalism is bad, try Communism!

The US will do just fine over time.


Socialism is killing us
said

Gary in NS, totally agree with you. These lefties think a government, any democratic government can manipulate the economy is completely braindead.


Mike
said

The conservatives (or any of the other rats) would take credit for the economy being good. Why should we not blame them when it goes bad?


island girl
said

I actually don't find any bad news in this.
It proves the price of oil is merely speculation, not supply and demand so it is falling (too bad!) to where it should be. Good. It also says the housing surplus could be absorbed by early next year, far earlier than I ever thought it would. Pretty good report I think, for the average person trying to put food on the table and avoided debt. So so sorry for the fat cat speculators.


HP in Ottawa
said

Al from Winnipeg has it right on the money. If you want to make some money investing today is the best day you will have in a long time to make that purchase. Many stocks in many companies will be selling at reduced prices as a reaction to the bailout news.

The stocks, along with the market will all recover in time and the more people buy the better for the market.


Right Wing Don
said

Hey there Robin...Some of us still like to be able to think on our own and not have to wait for some despotic dictator in a Central Government committee to tell the masses what to think and do. What you are advocating is ‘out of the Capitalist frying pan and into the Socialist fire’. Or, to put it in a more simple Socialist manner, from Bad to Worse.


James
said

After teetering for weeks now (or maybe even months), the world financial house of cards has finally tipped over. The exodus out of the market seen this afternoon will continue overnight in Asia and then Tues morning in Europe. When the bell rings on Wall Street tomorrow I would not be surprised if the market actually closes for fear of a full withdrawl by investors. It will not help. The sky is indeed falling and the landing will be very hard. Can you say "Depression," both financially and emotionally. Sure am glad those CEO's got their "Golden Parachutes." I am also glad I have other skills that I may yet use in a new economy. See you on the other side!


Robin the Hood
said

"Republicans are forced to vote in favour of a bail-out and more regulation.."

Sorry, was wrong on that one point.. they are even too arrogant and stupid to approve a bail out to save their own country - and ours - from a Depression like crash of the markets.. complete and utter fools to the nth degree. They actually didn't bother to listen to Warren Buffett's warning.. WOW!.. well, at least they have now committed political suicide for sure.. one positive in this storm.



sitting in the weeds
said

Al from winnipeg
Absolutly right ! buy,buy,buy, and when the panicked start coming back in............ up,up,up.


Alan - Toronto
said

Hey Naysayers,

It's the jump-off-the-wagon tendencies you display that unsettles the market.

The Canadian marketplace will affected by the US market, BUT we are in quite a different place. Governments have not been running insane deficits for decades. We have an intelligent economist in charge, not a whacko.

Quit the fear-mongering and relax. If we do hit rough waters, I'd rather have someone positive in charge than a doomsday advocate.


PJ
said

Looks like nice mess for next president and the world needs to stop judging it's own finances by the the US mess.
After all they are just a bunch of people in another world, even if in the same hemisphere as Canada we really don't need them to exist really do we like eveyone is lead to believe?


Larry in Wpg
said

With all the uncertainty south of the border, doesn't it make you all warm and fuzzy when you hear Dion & Layton throwing out their daily dose of billions of dollars of promises. Puts a whole new meaning to the term reckless. Steady as she goes with team Harper and the Conservatives.


DB Cooper
said

Don't rush to invest yet, the markets still have a long way to fall before they turn around.

As for how this will affect us (other than the obvious), the US is our largest trading partner and the vast majority of our exports go stateside. A downturn in their economy will mean a corresponding downturn in ours.


Nick J Boragina
said

Perhaps and Ignorant and don't understand the markets, but why is our Canadian market falling because the Americans don't have a bailout bill. I thought our past 4 governments (Harper, Martin, Chretien, Mulroney) all told us that this would not happen?


IRV
said

This is what happens when you can get 35 or 40 year mortgages and when you are able to borrow 100% of your home equity! In the US for a long time even your dog could get a credit card? We have already seen the effects in BC. The American housing market slowed down, the sawmills in BC starting closing. Which, in turn, affected the pulp mills. No wood to saw means NO pulp to produce paper, and so on.
Hang on folks, the times they are a changing!


George from Winnipeg
said

It is people like Harper and his followers that got the U.S. and now the rest of us into this mess. We need the best team possible to help us move ahead. The best team is not the Harper Conservatives. They could not manage an onion patch.


DjS
said

The price of crude Oil will continue to drop, yet it will cost over a buck to buy one measley litre. No matter the outcome..the oil companies will still be making "Record Profits" and the average consumer will be left on the hook.
There is not a thing the normal person can do.


Greedy #%$(#%'s
said

This is all due to greedy hedge fund managers, greedy mortgage brokers, greedy investment bankers and greedy partisan politicians, poor legislation and poorer regulators.

We all suffer as a result.

I have no doubt they will get it right and bring this bill into law and proved financial stability to the crediut marklets in teh States but all this could and should have been avoided.

In Canada we NEED to outlaw shorting of stocks. We NEED to stop investment bankers from trashing the markets. We NEED to get some teeth into regulatory services and not just have a face on it.




Mike
said

I've just loaded up on a bunch of shares, and am ready for the ride up on the roller coaster! :D


Carolyn
said

This is the reason we are having this unwanted, unnecessary, costly election. Harper knew what was coming with the economy.


Ken Riley
said

Please tell me I am too cynical. Did the house of representatives turn down the bailout because their big investor friends had already bailed out of the market. Now these people can buy back in at bargain prices and then the house will pass the bailout and the market will go back up. Frankly, as cynical as this thought is, it is better than a depression.


The other Canadian
said

I think that this is finally the time to reset all the prices across the board. the greed of everyone in general is to blame. If you watch how something is made, you know it costs pennies for practically everything out there. yet we are charged 2000% markup. Greed is the cause and I hope that this will reset everything back down to what stuff actually costs. Greed, Greed, Greed.
Looks good on them.


Tim
said

It may be out of the hands of the Prime Minister, however, his policies didn't really help it much. These right-wing notions of no taxes and big money for the big spender are certainly out of touch with what we're dealing with. We will be in dire need of a prime minister who's vision is of a Canada that is not one-track minded. We need a leader, someone who knows when to stand his ground and when to negotiate. Stephen Harper doesn't know how.


JJ from Saskatoon
said

I think we're missing something in all of this. Why are people only talking about "corporate greed" being the problem here? What about "consumer greed" - the need to have it all right now, a big house, exensive car, and all sorts of luxuries we can't really afford??? Just because the bank is willing to borrow me money doesn't mean I have to take it. Individuals also need to use their heads and show some self-restraint!


5th Generation Canadian
said

I'm sure by "sound economy" Mr. Harper was referring to Canada's hardworking and entreprenurial citizens. Just like John McCain. May as well continue the U.S. right-wing mantra.... eh,Steve?


Ian in Guelph
said

This whole mess isn't just because people took out mortgages that they couldn't afford, it's really because bankers re-sold those lousy debts after re-packaging them to look like better investments than they were. These architects of the subprime fiasco -deliberately- deceived investors and profited from that deception. Now that this grand-scale chicken has come home to roost the taxpayers are asked to bail out these institutions. What do the taxpayers GET for their thousands-of-dollars-each of investment? Nothing. Add it to the unconscionable debt that the U.S. has already accrued, and has no intention of repaying.

Let's pray that nobody tries to sell these irresponsible financial decisions as being something that they're not. That's what got those poor folks into this trouble in the first place.


Zoran
said

It's incredible that every time somebody tries to criticize lack of regulation in markets, right wingers start screaming "communist". I am so sick of that. Can you at least give benefit of doubt that some of us (who criticize you) are actually oriented towards regulated capitalism?


Anila from Vancouver
said

I think this is all emotional. US economy is not worth 700 billion. The Wall Street money junkies are having a withdrawal, and are kicking and crying because they did not get theirs in the House today.
In a couple of months things should be clearer and that Polson was lobbying for his buddies.


Andrew Koornstra, Harriston, Ontario
said

There is no one in particular to blame but our careless spending habits and living beyond our means thinking that it will buy happiness. Happiness is not measured by the externals but by the feeling of self-worth whether we have or have not. We must all pay the piper eventually and the government is not always in position to bail us out. Yes there is corporate greed and we just can't bail them out.


Robin the Hood
said

Right Wing Don
So you admit then that this "in your face" US capitalism is like being in a frying pan if not in the fire... interesting admission! Having some doubts perhaps? ;-)

Sound like the cracks are a crackin.



George
said

I'm willing to agree, this is not Harper's fault. There is little the Canadian prime minister can do to control the Canadian economy.

Oh, but many of you think I should vote Conservative because Harper is so good at managing the economy.

If the economy just happens, because of the USA, we don't need Harper.

I definitely don't want him managing the armed forces, the environmnet or the arts.

Sorry Stephen, your supporters have talked me out of even considering you as an option.


Liz
said

Maybe this is a good outcome...I think it is time that all the banks, highly paid CEO's etc Stick together and get themselves out of this mess. If they were stupid enough to loan people money to the point where the borrower has maxed out their credit. They only have themselves to blame. No pity. It just sucks that those who do live within their means, have their retirement income tied up investments have to pay the price. Unfortunately I am too scared to look. Where are all the billionares now?


pat
said

More banks will fail. The bottom has not yet been reached. You'd be dumb to invest right now.


Reece
said

@VINCE: The conservatives did influence the cost of oil...did you forget NAFTA? NAFTA ensured that Canadians receive no price advantage or edge in trade under any circumstances. NAFTA states that when the USA suffers from oil prices that we will as well.

I don't know about you, but when I fill up at a gas station I always think of Mulroney.


FreakAlert
said

"reciprocal currency arrangement"? Does this mean we purchase a declining USD, backed by a solid, robust currency?

And, what does this cost Canadian tax payers Mr Carney?


steve
said

Its really only a matter of time, before a NEW POWER comes about. The whole entire world is in the Beasts-USA hands and whatever they do or not affects everything. Now the other countries will see this, act upon it and for sure a NEW Power will arrise in the North...China, Russia, India, All those massive Countries..


It's about time
said

I for one am not personally effected by the stock market and I am glad to see the price of oil drop. All people should learn to live within their means and not be in debt. For those who are so inclined, I would think that this is now the time to invest in the stock market.


CaptainMorgan
said

I'm kind of glad they turned it down. They came up with this bail out package a little too quickly. Besides, this moment has been years in the making - it can't be solved so easily. These guys need to eat some humble pie.


Martin
said

'The fundamentals of Canada's economy are strong'...LMAO!


Charles(BC)
said

I guess Dion was right about the Canadian economy. Harper was wrong. It's now time for Canada to make the right decision and vote the Liberals into Government. They are the only party that can manage the Canadian economy in rough times. Remember Harper equals Mulroney, bad for the Canadian Ecomony.


Alex Nelson
said

If oil becomes cheap again and failures force financial companies to operate healthy and more federal oversight, at least their will be some upside to the credit crunch were facing.


Vivian Hansen
said

I agree that we haven't hit bottom yet. I have investments that I chose to leave in (I may reconsider in the next few days). But, I've had a few weeks to consider my own level of greed at a micro-level. It's where all of us should be soul-searching


Wolfe at the door
said

I'm going to get hate mail for this but here goes. Al Queda attacked the WTC in 93 with the express purpose of corrupting the west's economic process because they deemed it to be full of greed and deception. In 2001 the took down the WTC for the same reasons. Does it it not seem that perhaps Al Queda only had to wait? If greed and corruption, from Haliburton to the White House, did not exist would the whole western world be staring down a global depression? I am no terrorist, I was appalled at the destruction, but I have to think that Bin Laden is sitting in his cave in Pakistan laughing his ass off.


Charles Reid
said

Actually Robin Hood, you are wrong on most points. Firstly 40% of the Democrats voted against the bill.
Also, this crisis was not started by free market ideologists, although they continued along the same path.
The whole idea, originally sprung out of the Clinton era. In the early 90's they created the Fanny Mae and and Freddie Mac set ups. The idea was to make every American family a home owner.
Both these companies were under exterme pressure to lend money to all and sundry, regardless of their financial situation, even to the extent of counting Unemployment pay and Welfare pay as income.
Particular emphasis was put on lending to low income black people and latino's. Clinton , of course picked up huge support from these groups and the Democrats still do, which, of course, was the whole point.


dwayne
said

Why doesn`t Bill Gates just buy the United States??


Conservatism is killing this country
said

Garry, I agree with you that it is impossible for any governement to control what happens to the Canadian economy as a consequence of actions in the Stock Market. That's why it was really stupid and totally irresponsible is for Harper to publicly declare, on record, a few days ago that the economy in Canada is fine and that there will NOT be a recession under his Conservative government!!! These are Harper's own words! It shows that despite his economic training he cannot see further than the tip of his nose or that he is lying through his teeth!


Chris J from Barrie, ON
said

Why dont they just re-direct some of that money that we spend on gas to help out the economy?


Jayson K Mendoza
said

I truly hope that they include basic economics in our high school education in the future.

Reading these posts shows that almost nobody in this comment area has any idea what they are talking about in regards to economic policy and how the markets work.

There are few things the Feds can effect in a free market which generally has an effect on inflation.

1) Central Bank Interest rate - high interest rate generally encourages saving and reduces the cash being injected into the economy. This lowers inflation and the reverse is also true.

2) Federal reserve rate - This is the amount of cash assets each bank must hold of their total accounts (ie your checking and saving account balances). This has a drastic effect on the economy and is generally left up to the banks. Increasing this rate lowers the rate at which banks produce wealth and money, thus lowering inflation. This is a less then optimal way to effect it.

3) Deficit spending - This is unpopular with Canadian's but its a legitimate short term strategy. When an economy slows government spending can stimulate business and "jump start" the economy again. However this is a bad long term strategy as it is not sustainable. The reverse is also true, having a high surplus is also bad for the economy because it means the government has removed a bunch of wealth from it and is leaving it idle.

The best any Prime minister can do is the following...
1) Use government spending to generate business for the private sector over the short term.

2) Look for and emphasize trade with other nations

3) Work to re-assure citizens that their economy is under control. (If people get into a fear frenzy the economy will spiral downward out of control)

4) Make Canada more attractive for business


Darryl
said

This will sting a bit for me in the short term, However long term it'll be smooth sailing! After all I've still got nearly 40 years to go before I retire! To blame any one political party for this is nonsense! it happens people. we just have to tighten our belts and roll with the punches.




Robb in Oilberta
said

So, apparently according to Robin the Hood and friends, all this comes down to our capatalistic system. Hmmmm, if you ask me (and no one did) it simply comes down to human nature. It does not matter whether it is our democratic capatalistic system, socialism, communism or any other "ism", that fact is, no matter what the political system mankind is selfish, greedy etc. and any system and all political systems have always been manipulated by the few.

I agree, the system is flexible enough to handle this and will bounce back and I also agree, it would not matter which party is in power, it's going to happen period.


wc
said

The two markets are connected. This is not unexpected.

The litle guy gets nothing out of this but more economic pain whether "The Handout" goes through or not.

So, who cares?


Makinaw Dandy
said

Every now and again, I hear criticism from people who say that USA is better than Canada because there is too much government in Canada. These people are ardent capitalists and always extoll the virtues of "less government is better" etc etc... But, this episode shows us what happens when there is not enough government controls. The capitalists compete with each other to sell more and more credit, for them it is like a kind of race to see which bank can sell the most loans fastest. The bankers are only looking for their short term interests. They want to get rich and get out before the bubble bursts. In contrast, Canadian banks have more government controls. They cannot make weak loans. My final thought is that, in the long term, government control is a good thing. More government control is good.


scott
said

With all the turmoil in the US, and the politicians here competing for soundbites to tell us all our financial institutions are fine will anyone give odds on which Canadian institution falls first. I think in the coming days will find out?????


brendan in fredricton
said

HYe Al from winnipeg!!

I agree...im making a killing buying everytime it crashes. Hilarious. Most of this is perpetrated by the ignorant responding to sensationalism from he press..and the liberal spinners. The canadian economy is the safest in the world..so buy Canadian mutuals


Tony, Ontario
said

Ah well, what comes up must go down, and, with 30 odd years left to retirement, I think I'll invest a bit more in my RSP tomorrow.


bren in fredtown
said

I just saw a comment that PM Harper knew this was going to happen and wanted to hasten an election before it crashed. As if. Maybe we went to election because people like me ..who got saddled with a liberal MP in the LAST election, have had no federal voice because the LIbs have sayt out nearly every vote!! Thats a broken system. And as for the economy..we have the highest transfer payments to the provinces thanks to Harper that we have had in 30 years, and the lowest taxes in the same amount of time..so..who are u voting for?..Oh..and he is also in favour of banning shorting of stocks. Gets my vote this time around!!


Gary Toronto
said

Don't you get it. The US owes billions and billions to places like China and elsewhere. So why not devalue the US dollar by 50 or 60% by bailing out these companies with taxpayers money. The US dollar falls on the International market and all those people who are owed US dollars find out they are worth much much less. Its called Economic War. Why pay back any of these countries. They made a poor investment in the US. So what, we all make poor investments now and again. This is horrifying the Chinese and Saudis who have invested all their cash into the US just to find its maybe worthless. Notice the German bank that just went under. I mean really did you think we were going to actually make good on our foreign debt when we cannot make good on our domestic.


Gail (Hamilton)
said

The nice thing about all this crisis is that it can be worked out and not bought out. As Lou Dobbs said tonight, the American people won with the defeat of the bill. Both Democrats and Republicans know who the creators are of this crisis and FBI investigations will bring more to the forefront eventually. As for Jack Layton, he's only interested in finance for what it will buy him in votes and how he can spend the taxpayer's money. Charles Reid makes some very good points.


Chris
said

You can't have stock markets constantly climbing... it's designed to crash to bring global economic stabilization. QUIT PANICKING!!! LIFE STILL WILL GO ON!!!!


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