CTV News | CAW officials to meet with GM CEO on Friday

Top Stories -   

CAW officials to meet with GM CEO on Friday

Viewer

CTV News Video

CTV News: Scott Laurie with reaction from employees
CTV Toronto: Naomi Parness looks at why GM shut down the building where employees were protesting
Finance Minister Jim Flaherty speaks to the press about what he plans to do about the GM closures
CTV Newsnet: Joel Smith, a GM employee, with details on how much seniority could be needed to keep a job
CTV Newsnet: Chris Buckley, president of the Canadian Auto Workers union Local 222, explains why this is taking place
Canada AM: David Paterson, VP of corporate affairs for GM, on what the company is doing to help the workers
Canada AM: BNN's Michael Kane with market reaction to the GM closures
CTV National News: Lisa LaFlamme reports on the devastating blow at General Motors
CTV Newsnet: Chris Buckley, president of the Canadian Auto Workers union Local 222, explains why this is taking place

Font-size:      Share  Print  Comments(158)

ctvtoronto.ca

Date: Wed. Jun. 4 2008 6:04 PM ET

Officials with the Canadian Auto Workers union Local 222 have secured a meeting with General Motors chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner in Detroit on Friday morning.

But local union president Chris Buckley says the blockade angry workers set up at the company's Canadian head office in Oshawa, Ont., will remain in place.

Buckley said he was disappointed union leaders couldn't meet with Wagoner on Wednesday.

Workers are hosting the demonstration to protest the closure of a truck assembly plant by the end of next year.

Earlier in the day, Buckley said the blockade would be in place for "as long as it takes."

At least 100 workers wearing red T-shirts with the logo "Made in Canada Matters'' formed the blockade at about 4:30 a.m. The size of the group grew throughout the day, and other local unions joined in as well.

GM decided to shut the building down for the day and send staff home. There are about 1,000 employees at the headquarters, and some worked from other locations or from home.

Production at the Oshawa plant and three other North American factories will be shut down next year in response to "a clear shift from trucks and SUVs toward cars and crossovers" among North American buyers, the company said.

All of the plants slated for closure assemble pickup trucks or sport utility vehicles.

GM said Tuesday the closure will eliminate 1,000 jobs in Oshawa, but union leaders said there are 2,600 people who will be out of work at the plant.

"We are demanding that General Motors reverse their decision to close their best truck plant in the corporation," Buckley told CTV's Canada AM on Wednesday morning.

"At the very least, we're demanding that the General Motors executives sit down with us so that we can attempt to work through this."

David Paterson, vice-president of corporate and environmental affairs for GM Canada, said Wednesday morning the doors were "wide open" for talks. He said company officials were already on the ground talking to union leaders.

Paterson said the company shares in the frustration being felt by workers.

"We're clearly facing a really fundamental shift from trucks to cars in the marketplace and we're going to have to adjust to that," Paterson told CTV's Canada AM.

Buckley said the union is upset because they just finished bargaining a new three-year collective agreement, which was ratified two weeks ago.

"General Motors committed to us in writing that we would get the next generation of light-duty pickup trucks," Buckley said.

"As of yesterday, General Motors has betrayed us and that is bad-faith bargaining."

Gord Fitzgerald, who has worked for the automaker for more than 20 years, protested with his five-year-old daughter on Wednesday. Fitzgerald has two other children to provide for.

"It's the people that give them the quality, not the product, so give us a different product and we'll give them award-winning quality with that," he told CTV Toronto.

To help ease the transition, Paterson said GM is going to try to maximize the number of people who can move directly onto a GM pension.

"It's a much better way than moving people to layoff," he said.

Paterson said the final solution to the problem is to "produce the right kind of cars that people want to buy."

Buckley said workers were instructed to stay on the job Wednesday.

"I am telling my members in the workplace to remain on their jobs. I want my members to continue to build the best trucks in the industry and the best cars in the industry," he said.

"Let the local union leadership handle the situation."

Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty says he sympathizes with the workers affected by the plant closure.

"I can understand where these men and women are coming from -- this is their livelihood," McGuinty told reporters.

"My assurance to them is that we will continue to fight as hard as we can for new investment in Ontario and we will also do everything we can to help them get back on their feet."

The premier says he will announce details in the coming days about the government's skills training plan for those whose jobs are at risk.

McGuinty said he remains optimistic that Oshawa will land more auto jobs in the future.

GM's shift in direction will see the company add more small, fuel-efficient vehicles to its roster. It also has plans to have the Chevrolet Volt -- a plug-in electric car -- in dealers' showrooms by the end of 2010.

The cuts announced on Tuesday should save GM US$1 billion a year, in addition to earlier cuts worth roughly US$15 billion.

With a report from CTV Toronto's Naomi Parness

Comments are now closed for this story

Jim
said

Did't the provincial Liberal Government just give GM Hundreds of millions of dollars. And then they go and do this. Its time this provincial government stopped talking and blaming and work on solutions for the automobile industry.
Thanks


Mark
said

Of course the union workers at $40/hour with nice cushy benefits will protest the golden goose closing her nest.

Perhaps the series of strikes, militant unions and entitled union workers will take a closer look in the mirror now when looking for who to blame.

-legendary gas prices
-collapse of the housing in US mortgage business
-slowing economy
-Liberals and 'Kyoto'.

Reality strikes ladies and gentlemen.
-


mario
said

Sorry for losing your jobs and all. I've been through it twice and had to relocate my family. The fact of the matter is they can't keep the plant open to continue building vehicles that the public are not going to purchase. GM doesn't have a move forward strategy, and I suspect to refit the plant to build a new type of vehicle would take some time. The Ontario government keeps shifting tax money to the automaker in a make work project that has seen more jobs leave and GM fill their pockets with tax money. Real leadership would go looking for opportunities to leverage out workforce to build more efficient vehicles, whether that be GM Canada or the McGuinty Liberals. It doesn't really matter, because the Liberals will keep being voted in and nothing will change. They will leave you high and dry and make you leave your families to go work in the wilderness of Alberta.


Dave
said

These workers should take a big pay cut. They
make way too much for what they do.

Dave


FRAZ
said

GOOD FOR THEM UNION SOLIDARITY!!!! I HOPE EVERY C.A.W EMPLOYEE ALL 2,600 STRONG GO ON STRIKE. THEN GM MANAGEMENT CAN ANOUNCE THEIR PROFITS WITH NO PRODUCTION AND AN ANGRY WORK FORCE.


bman
said

One has to wonder about the management of the Big Three when they continued to manufacture the gas guzzlers in the face of this long-forseeable shift in comsumer demand. Inexplicably sudden announcements such as this one are the result -- no wonder workers are outraged.


Steve in Aylmer
said

Ever read the book "Who Moved My Cheese".

To the workers at GM:

Someone just moved your cheese!

If you're looking for suggestions on what song you should have playing as you drive out of town...try "My HomeTown" by Bruce Springsteen.

"Foreman say's these jobs are going boy's and they ain't coming back, to your hometown, to your hometown..."


JoeC
said

While the United States and Europe allow Canadian built electric cars on their city streets, Canada still refuses to allow electric cars that are built here, in Canada, on Canadian city streets, because they are not "safe" in Canada, but are safe in the United States and Europe.

What's wrong with this picture?



Wayne Ouellette
said

Feel for the families involved here but it was only a matter of time. The days of mama driving around the city in a Hummer or a full size pickup, to go shopping, are over. Years of mismanagement,
poor planning and excessive labour costs. The industry has a place here with the right products but even mcguinty can't buy his way out of this issue or blame everybody else. Thanks to the people who make decisions, there may be more people leaving the province and going where the jobs are. That would be, Alberta, Sask and NFLD. Meanwhile back in old Ontario we will continue to vote in liberals and suffer the consequences.


greg
said

heres what our dumb Liberal goverment gave us for millions of wasted dollars...wake up,it's a new world and this industry has been disappearing for years.Either put our money into the new economy or give it back to us with tax breaks



BOB
said

There is a good chance that GM could go bankrupt due to the downturn in the US economy. Then the plant in question will close. Then what ?


pp
said

Silly People !

Don't they know that by walking off the job they are in fact saving the company money? And they themselves are NOT making money?

So funny. I was almost feeling sorry for these people but now I just think they are Union Brainwashed Sheep. Baaaaaaaa.....

How's the 'Walk off the Job' thing working for you guys - eh?

People - Get a trade - Get a real job and Get security.

Education + Skills + Gumpshun = job security. Of course you're likely NOT going to make $40/hr and get your lovely all important benefits and pension plan. But if you manage your money and live within your means you should do well. I do... OH and maybe just maybe you will find a job that you really really enjoy! I did... But I guess I have not been brainwashed to think I am incapable of doing anything better with my life.




Sandra
said

Go back twenty years when a friends son was only nineteen years old earning twenty dollars an hour driving a bike in the Oshawa plant delivering parts around.You wonder what happen to GMJ????.
Give your head a shake.
Unions killed GM in Canada.


Sandy
said

I agree with Mark,

Just suck it up things like this happen - it is called life. The economy is to blame, not GM. GM workers should go find a job that is more secure if they don't like being laid off.

The way to go is smaller, more fuel economy vehicles, Hybrids....... It is about time that we take the environment into consideration and not drive big SUV's and Trucks.


Peter
said

This is just another example of the CAW and Buzz Unionizing our workers out of there jobs. Before you cry for these workers remember that Canada is the most expensive country in the world to build cars.


Cris
said

Quote:
Chief Executive Rick Wagoner's salary and other compensation rose 64 percent in 2007 to about $15.7 million, mainly due to option grants, according to a proxy filed on Friday.
Wagoner's compensation rose from about $9.57 million in 2006. The figure was arrived at based on Wagoner's salary, all other compensation and the basis of annual grants.

GM paid Wagoner a salary of $1.6 million in 2007, along with $1.8 million in non-equity incentive compensation and nearly $700,000 for other compensation that includes insurance benefits, security, aircraft expenses and other factors.

No wonder GM is losing money..




Sean
said

It's time that Buzz Hargrove started negotiating with foreign car manufacturers to import some of their cheaper and gas efficient automobiles and start building them here. The Big 3 should have seen this coming years ago and changed the product they try to shove down our throats at crazy prices.


Matt
said

So the next time that you buy your brand new truck from GM and it does not work properly spends most of the time in the shop getting fixed only to reveal coffee cups, garbage and god knows what else inside the dashboard and under every nook and crany, you can thank a disgruntled auto worker!! Do you think that the quality of vehicle that will be produced from these plants in the next year will be anything less than disappointing given the relationship between the workers and the company? I am no expert but when workplace moral is down, workers only do the bare minimum to the detrement, of in this case the new potential consumer. I have purchased many a GM product and i can tell you never again. I have not had many issues thankfully but i cannot stand the blame the next person approach and reactive thinking to the market place. As an auto manufacturer GM has a duty to provide the vehicles that the general public would like to drive. If this does not happen the consumer will go elsewhere. So when this plant closes, will there be any replacement parts available for these vehicles or is that closing too? Thankfully Oshawa is diversified enough to absorb the brunt of this closure but the sting and bitter resentment will be felt for the next generation! It was a good run and cannot last forever.


Windsor Non-Auto Worker
said

Staging a protest is ineffective, and only demonstrates (again) the immature and unprofessional mindset of these CAW members. One has to sit back and ask, "how can we contribute to change this?" and then determine what each option will accomplish. A protest accomplishes nothing more than bitter feelings, and enhances the belief by the general public that overpaid workers are acting like children throwing tantrums when the piggy bank was empty. Handling this in a rationale manner may result in more Canadians supporting you. The entire auto industry is shifting right now, and it's unfortunate for the Big 3 that they didn't jump onto the hybrid and smaller vehicle bandwagon years ago, when the imports did. With some restructuring, we'll likely see these plants open again, but they can't continue to produce vehicles that today's market can't support. Grow up.


JPT
said

Workers--The fact is costs are at top dollars.
Mainly because of hourly wages, wonderful benefits and if life isn't peachy let's just go on diabilty for six months.I know several GM employees that think this is what they are entitled too--just because they work for GM. Well guess what I own two GM products and will not be buying another--Two trani's in one after 120,ooo miles. What a joke--the ride is over fellas and good luck living on what the rest of us have had to.


B. MacKenzie
said

I understand that a large consumer shift away from trucks and SUV’s would result in GM reducing the number of trucks and SUV’s it manufactures; however, you can’t tell me that GM did not know two weeks ago that they were going to shut down the Oshawa plant. GM knew they were going to shut down the plant and purposely lied to it’s workers in order to get them to concede millions in benefits and took millions from the government. That is bad faith bargaining and GM should be ashamed. I was looking to buy a new GM vehicle; however, now I will give my money to Ford who said they will honour their agreement.


TKendell
said

Many people fail to realize that it takes up to 5 years to conceive, develop, and produce a new vehicle. Today's gas guzzlers are the product of $1.25 gas back in 2003-4. GM, Ford and Chrysler actually have some exciting product in the pipeline... they are fully aware of 35 mpg CAFE standards that are coming, as well as the pain of $4-5/gallon gas. The truck plants will shut down production in late 2009, but will tool up for a new generation of efficient vehicles in 2010 and beyond. Don't panic, guys. You're just witnessing a major restructuring of the auto indusrty.


Greed has its conseqences...
said

GM was sideswiped by the particularly quick and recent rise in fuel prices and despite their negotiating labour contracts were just overwhelmed by the impact it was having in sales. The crux is that they should have seen this coming because predictions (peak oil etc) were for much higher prices yet they foolishly kept building big gas guzzling vehicles to serve the wannabe crowd demanding SUV's and fancy, not for work, pick ups. Now Ford and GM have to retool quickly and Chrysler should be next to announce cutbacks. Meanwhile, the Japanese have been announcing new hybrids for Honda and Toyota.









Where was Bizz Hargrove?
said

Where was Buzz when he saw this consumer shift years ahead of time? Where was Buzz Hargrove when he should have been pestering GM to shift their focus? Where was Buizz Hargrove then? One the golf course? One thing for certain he wasn't looking ahead for the members of the union. This mess works both ways.






Mark
said

Dave and Mark, how can you blame workers for making a decent wage!
Do you go into your boss in the morning and offer to work for less and then give away your families health bennifts?


2-doorEcho
said

Why did they keep producing big 8-cylinder vehicles? Chev, Ford and Chrysler are lucky this didn't happen 5 years ago.


Steve G
said

Well it certainly didn't take long for the neo-con corporate cheerleaders to come out of the woodwork.

GM is violating a collective agreement that was signed off two weeks ago.

It's unfortunate you don't have the stones to standup to your employer and demand they live up to their end of a deal. With such weakness and apathy, it is no wonder wages and benefits aren't keeping up with the cost of living.

Best of luck to the Oshawa workers-stand united.



D.D.
said

Well here is what happens when you let unions get out of hand. Any 'donkey' that gets $40 per hour to install a nut on a car door finally get their just reward. While unions are allowed to get away with their silly demands, the public will suffer. Get rid of the unions and let people work at reasonable rates. No more job cuts.


David fm NS
said

Seems as if Mr. McGuinty should have listened to Minister Flaherty rather than give millions to GM. I guess it will get him re-elected, but not so good for Ontario's economy.


Ollie
said

Let's see now...since we're playing the 'blame game' let's see who is eligible:
1.) The Ontario Provincial Government for playing a parental role and buying blue collar votes by 'giving' our tax dollars away,
2.) CAW members by being duped into thinking that there really is 'job security' and by thinking that education means nothing and that they are 'entitled' to a very good income (yes, very good all things considered),
3.) Fat-cat CAW union management for duping the CAW members year after year,
4.) The Canadian and American federal governments for allowing these gas guzzlers on the road to begin with unless you have a business that requires having carrying or towing capacity,
5.) The American and Canadian consumers who insist that they will drive what they want to drive in spite of the cost to us all,
6.) General Motors who continue to fumble (or so it seems) from one crisis to the next,
7.) Speculators who have helped to drive the price of crude into an unknown territory and
8.) Who have I forgotten as the list is getting so long that it's becoming a calamity not a plant closure.


Edb
said

Wow! are these guys for real??? WAKE UP you fools, the bubble has burst. You think you can force GM (or any company) to produce a product that no one wants. All just to keep you in a bolt turning job for 30/hr.
These union guys are truly delusional!


George
said

I do believe that GM and the CAW are both equally responsible for this situation, but it's maddening how the CAW points the finger and blames others without looking at their own organization. The CAW membership consists of over 15,0000 members in "Other Transportation" industries across Canada. (check their website) More than 5000 of them in public transit - an industry whose sole purpose is to get cars OFF the road. How does the CAW fairly represent those members AND the automotive sector members who's sole purpose is to get MORE cars ON the road?
Unions are businesses, the CAW is a poorly operated one that believes labour tactics from the 50's and 60's will work in this era of globalization.


Tyler
said

The answer here is really simple if your idiots in Goverment could just figure it out.

Tell Japan, Korea, and China, etc. that for every car they sell here, they have to take one imported "Big Three" car over there.

Sure, some of "their" cars are made here, but where do the profit $$ go???

If they can profit in our market, then why can't we profit in theirs???



Andrew
said

" for as long as it takes" For what? The facts and reality to suddenly change. Another dumb union move. If my company looses money and lays me off or fires me I'm on my own. If a union member gets let go he runs to the union an complains about management harassment or mismanagement. Then it's the picket line dance again.

Paul
said

Face facts: job security doesn't exist any more, regardless of the union and how much you pay in union dues, there is no such thing any more and hasn't existed for many years.

I hope the government doesn't bail out the auto industry again. Unions are very much out of step with reality with the rest of the Canadian work force.

Douglas
said

Unfortunately there is an essential and irrevocable truth here. As painful as it is for the GM workers (and everyone needs to recognize the ramifications for these workers, their families and their community), this is simply an other indication of the reality that we all face.
"You better starting swimming or you'll sink like a stone, for the times they are achangin"
Kind of scary too!
Doug


sdgreen
said

Silly Unions! Buzz Hargrove and the CAW need realize that artificial and a kings ransom for wages and benifits will not result in full employment.

Unions are one of the reasons our economy is so fragile.

R J
said

Gee lets go set up road blocks
...Let's protest

$40.00 an hour double that on over time

80% pay when your layed off

GEE WHY ARE WE CLOSING PLANTS hay I got an idea lets stop work ..boy we'll show them in head office.

NOW lets not forget those boys in the GLASS house ever wonder about there pay and benifits ?

When the rest of us poor bastards lost our jobs nobody bailed us out.

Bring on a lower priced better fuel operating car...AH !! now which would you buy.

Sorry I don't feel one bit hurt for any of the auto workers


Todd
said

Congratulations CAW - Another group of your team about to be unemployed.

See the trend yet? How many plants in SW Ontario (assembly and parts plants) are suffering? The list is too long... and the CAW is attached to most of them.

Union workers take note...you're on a sinking ship. Find a job where you can work hard and rest on your own merits... not those of a Union, banding together to make ridiculous demands, and sinking industry!




Carol Flowers
said

Yes the sisters and brothers at GM make good money with good benefits.
Something that was NEGOTIATED over the years through the CAW. Without a union do you think GM would be paying these people $30 an hour, NO!
I am sick of people saying well you make good money, suck it up, and do what go join the millions working for $9 an hour at Walmart??
That should really get the economy booming.
Yes these workers make good money for a job that is tedious, boring, and in most cases they have injuries due to the repetitive work.
Despite everything Oshawa is the #1 plant because the workers do care about the product they build and GM needs to give the town of Oshawa some security for the future.
Do not forgot that there is a lot of tax paying dollars that come out of that plant for a $30 an hour job, 46 per cent of it goes to the government.
For years we have been supporting numerous charties, GM workers put a huge amount of money into the hospital and not to mention the tax payers money that went for the people who were too lazy to work and sat at home on welfare.
I fear to think what Oshawa will be like if we lose all of GM, nothing but a ghost town.
Shame on you Oshawa residents who put these hard working people down, whether you like it or not it IS your bread and butter also



darren
said

I just heard on the news that Dalton McGuinty says this is not really a big deal and that he thinks good things are in store for gm in Oshawa. Why is this guy still in power?


George
said

TYLER - Do you honestly think there is a market for huge N.American vehicles in Asia? You can open a market all you want, but you can't force them to buy the product, especially when the average monthly wage in some Asian countries are equal to what a GM worker makes in an HOUR!



TKG
said

Protest - They haven't all walked off the job, parts are still being produced. Not all the workers at the plant work the same shift.

Wages- Why does everyone protest union members wages, but not that of senior management? Or executives? How about they take a pay cut, or reduced benefits during their retirement.
And side note, the high wages also help compensate for the high toll on one's physical body that a lot of the jobs have. Not everyone is turning a screw.

To pp- Some of them are in the trades. Like metal workers, electricians, and look where it's gotten them. Still about to be laid off.


Tara
said

These workers need to realize that yes, they had it good. Now it is over. They need to get a skill. An education. For all the people saying "some people didn't have the luxury of an education" YES you did and still can. It's all about choice. Choose to get rid of your vehicle, not have cable, not have a cell phone, have a small house, and live with either a job when you go to school, or get a student loan. Many of us did it this way. Don't cry to Canada that you can't get a job because you have no skills. That is your fault and your fault alone.


Madashell
said

Are these 'workers' for real? If nobody wants your product why on earth would you keep on making it? Grow up and GET RID OF THE UNION. The unions will kill this country. Remember what happened in the UK? Thatcher broke the unions down and now (after a lean time) things are VERY good and most businesses do not have to put up with the Arrogant and useless unions any more. Oh, I agree when the unions started, The Tolpuddle Martyrs were very needed, but NOW, the Unions have had their day.


Danny
said

Breaking news: GM doesn't care.


Too Bad, So Sad
said

My coworkers and I all felt we were underpaid so we threatened management that we wouldn't work until we all got a raise. The bullying paid off since collectively we had the power in this situation.
Six months goes by and I'm loving my raise, I'm making a tonne of cash and I barely have to work at all for it.

Now, my company has come on hard times and is no longer making a profit. The company needs to downsize and cut costs where necessary. I was axed since I made more money than my job warranted.

This story is fiction, but the reality is not.

Every person in every industry needs to work for their money. Unions have destroyed GM from the inside and those workers have their own ignorance to blame.

You all should suck it up and stop expecting handouts. Get retrained and get another job, simple as that.


Max
said

To GM Workers:
THE TAIL CAN'T WAG THE DOG; ESPECIALLY WHEN THE DOG IS ALMOST DEAD. YOUR COLLECTIVE AGREEMENT WAS TOO LITTLE TOO LATE, FOLKS. YOUR COMPANY MAKES A PRODUCT PEOPLE DON'T WANT. DESPITE THE FOOLISH INVESTMENT OF TAXPAYER MONEY BY YOUR GOVERNMENT, THE FAT LADY HAS BEEN SINGING FOR A LONG WHILE. IT'S TIME TO QUIT PRETENDING YOU'VE BEEN HOOD-WINKED, AND GET A JOB WITH A COMPANY THAT UNDERSTANDS ITS OWN MARKET.


bruce nicolson
said

How can anyone see this as a surprise?For years Japanese imports have been dominating the market because of higher quality and better fuel economy.
The big 3 and their unions wre operating in never never land and refused to make meaningful change.
McGuinty,s govt.is also treating us like idiots.
He subsidizes the truck industry while bringing in a cap and trade system!!How long are we going to accept this incompetence?


pp
said

To TKG from pp:

Yes they have a skill and now they can go out and get another job. All good things must come to an end. I changed from a Nurse (after 12 yrs) when Mike Harris decided we no longer needed Nurses and went into IT - I am a Programmer Analyst make way more money and have a better job - no weekends, no shift work, pension, benefits full time work... but it was NOT easy - I had to WORK MY BUTT OFF.

These workers need to understand that life is what you make of it. NOT what someone else makes for you. Esp these silly unions who make these people think they are incapable of doing nothing else. Brainwashed into thinking they will get nothing else - baaaaaaa.....

I am no sheep that's for sure.... I make my own way in the world. So should they.


Viv
said

This militancy is all for show and may prevent GM from ever building vehicles here again. They have lots of manufacturing locations to choose from. Bottom line GM is caught with its pants down with this swift change in market conditions and cannot continue producing these big vehicles that don't sell well.In order to remain labour competitive the CAW will have to agree to the USA UAW two tier labour rate. Dealing with a bloated union wage rate will be a challenge. Also, what seems lost in all of this is this entitlement mentality. Labour is a commodity like everything else GM purchases for manufacture. GM does not exist just to provide jobs. Finally how come just down the road in Alliston and Woodstock business has never been better and everybody's smiling?


Unions are archaic
said

Unions were meant for the sweat shops and abuses of people way back when in North America. Not for the modern worker who does a specified number of hours at very reasonable working rates with benefits and bonuses to boot....


Po
said

I hope GM has to pay back every dollar in incentives they've gotten from the provincial government.

And don't go blaming Liberals or Conservatives, this is GM not living up to its promises (and if you've bought one of their cars, you'll notice this is a recurring theme with them).

CAW workers have every right to be angry but instead of crying over spilled milk, why not go to other car manufacturers and offer them the workers, the plant (which I'm sure could be converted to make compacts or something else)and the incentives you'll get back from GM?

Obviously GM is struggling and it has been for YEARS, why not try to lure Toyota, Honda, Subaru or Nissan over to Oshawa instead of trying to deal with an employer who has proven himself to be unreliable.


John
said

You should have protested at the time of your last 3 or 4 contract negotiations, that is for lower wages. $30-$40 an hour plus all those benefits is absurd for a high school ed and for a job you walk into off the street.


Paul B
said

I think most on here are missing the point of the union and workers anger. Just two weeks ago GM signed a contract guaranteeing the Oshawa plant would be the main supplier of GM trucks, as well as the main plant for the new hybrid pick-ups to be built in a years time.

In exchange for that workers gave up wages, benefeits, vacation time, etc., saving GM millions in exchange for future production. The workers have a right to be angry. If this was just a normal plant closure that would be a different story. The fact GM took the concessions based on false promises(given in writing), is what has given rise to this protest.


Ted
said

It's funny. I've been buying Japanese and European vehicles for years now. When I was a younger lad I had a Dodge that blew an engine, then a Plymouth, 2 engines later, I decided to never buy any 'Big 3' vehicle again. I've never had a problem since. My decision wasn't anything against the autoworkers. Yet, my father insists it keeps jobs in Canada (Ontario) to buy these hunks of garbage. I live in a democracy that instills freedom of choice. Most people are moving away from these vehicles, and as discussed above, the economy can't tolerate these gas guzzlers anymore. I read someones comment above inferring new vehicles take 5 years to make it to market. Why has it taken 20, and GM still does not get it. Innovate, evolve. Time for resolve, band-aid solutions will ultimately fail. Create a decent vehicle. You can create a decent quality product at less of a cost (Union Benefits). European and Japanese automakers do.


wont allow this
said

I really dislike Buzz Hargrove but in this instance he is right. If we allow this betrayel than I will never buy another North American vehicle as long as I live. and im proud north american.


SHEEP - BAAAAAAHH
said

What you all fail to realize is that salaries are staying stagnant, or declining, and the cost of living is rising. We are being pushed into being a slave society. The rich get richer, and the poor get poorer. This is yet another attempt to attack the middle class. So long social services!!! - Who'se going to pay the bulk of the taxes. Enjoy your quality of life.


DCR
said

A shame that this many jobs are being lost, but it is the new reality. How can this plant keep building vehicles that no one will buy? I do feel for these people, but I think they must open their eyes at just how good they have had it for so long. I am 37 years old from the west and have had to change careers 5 times already to make ends meet.(and yes that was the reality here in the west for decades)Businesses/demands change and that is what is happening. If you want to make the same money or better, go west and work on the oil rigs, pipeline, agriculture sector, mining, endless trades, etc. I realize that you may have to actually put your back into it, but you will get used to earning what you work for. The union gravy train is coming to an end. And now you have 400,000 million dollars that your dear Mr. Premier, Dalton has simply given away. You let a completely capable conservative premier pass you by over one issue of faith based schools. Well, you reap what you sew, Ontario. There are tens of thousands of jobs across the prairies and in BC. Just leave your liberal votes over there!


Jeebus
said

This is the biggest problem with the GM and Ford. Unions! GM closes truck plants to stay competive and build products the market require and the unions say its all about them. The workers are over paid and dreamers. Good luck competing with the forign car makers with the demands you have. Try working with GM to make the company better instead demanding more...
IT can be done. GM amkes the best products in the world. Everyone need to get on board!


Nowonder
said

This is the result of the lack of vision by the Canadian Government and industry. Canada should have demanded GM to build smaller cars here too, besides the huge gas guzzlers. Now it is too late. Come on! Forecasters had to know that with the price of gas and the concern for the environment, the market for big vehicles was going to dwindle.
Unless Canada starts working on green energy and green product manufacturing, this is only the beginning of what will happen to our industry.


Steve
said

These people are sad. Did they not see this coming? The gravy train has left. Get an education now, and go find another job, like every other non-unionized person has to do!

P.S. don't go all psycho when you try to get back into the workforce and can't find a $35/hr job with all them cushy benefits!


OshawaGal
said

Good then protest! Maybe the company will close it earlier so we don't have to listen to your whining anymore! YOU THE AUTO WORKER AND THE CAW DID THIS TO YOURSELF! Your union is sooo good it screwed you all out of a job because you are all too greedy. And don't tell me all the GM money made stays in Oshawa , have any of you looked at the south end lately? There is a lot of money that rolls through that area on shift change, yet it resembles a ghetto on Wentworth St so where is that GM employee cash being spent?
So again ..suck it up! blame yourself, not the company, you are becoming too much a liability to the company so like any smart company they are doing some house cleaning. I think they should have canned you all ages ago, along with your union.
Kudos to GM


Tracy
said

Mr.R.S McLaughlin would be rolling in his grave right now, what a disgrace to a man that worked so hard building this company up. G.M belongs to Oshawa, are we forgetting who funded this company, to begin with? The history of automotive was formed in Oshawa, the least they could do is secure our residence with jobs, wake up people, we still need pick up trucks no matter the price of gas, and building them in Mexico is cheaper. If we don't take a stand all our jobs will be going to Mexico. Our Oshawa workers deserve every penny they get,ever been in G.M? They are locked in like prisoners. Stand up for our rights, We are the government!! Not those suit wearing aholes who are over paid and stealing our money and not allowing Canada to export our cars and trucks, Your all like a bunch of puppets, only the public can change gas prices, don't buy it, force them to bring down the price. If we all just stuck to one gas company the others would have no choice but to change the price, we make them rich, they are playing a nasty game!!


Kevin in Sk
said

You know that the carbon trading scheme was a factor in this decision right? GM is still building trucks somewhere, the fact that Ontario is not the place is maybe something you should take up with your premier.

People say carbon needs to have a cost; this is it. The cost is lost jobs, lost industry, and human misery.


Wendy
said

And this is the problem with Unions. It is a sad day when a Union dictates or tries to dictate to a company how to run their business. Sad, Sad Day.

My heart goes out to these people but hey, that's life in Ontario/Canada and the manufacturing sector period.


Chris
said

It's really disgusting seeing some people blaming the workers, and some of you taking some sort of sick joy at seeing them out of work. Those of you with these feelings should be ashamed of yourself. You're a disgrace.

It's not the workers fault that they make good money. Who among you would turn down a $40/hr job with a good pension and good benefits plan? That's right...

And those of you saying "just accept it..." Would you just sit back when you were told you're losing your job? You wouldn't fight, or try to figure something out? Get off the soap boxes you're accusing the GM workers of standing on.


June
said

Sorry, GM workers, this is capitalism at work. Companies prosper or they close, that's life, so suck it up and move on. Unions have demanded high wages and led their members down the path to think they deserve to have everything handed to them, now they're paying for it. Let them picket all they want. I hope GM sticks to its guns and even closes the plant sooner than expected. Oh, and please don't move yourselves and your families to Alberta.


barb.
said

Really, these picketers are wasting valuable time. They need to face reality.....its over. And its going to get a lot worse. The glory days are done.Better start looking for another way to earn a living, and fast.


WTL
said

If no one is buying trucks, then you close the factory that makes trucks, otherwise you make trucks that no one buys, or just pay people to stand around.

It makes business sense to close the plant until demand changes. Perhaps retool the plant to make something else?


Jim
said

Living in Western Canada, I just hope that GM isn't moving towards the elimination of their light trucks and SUVs. While lots of city folks have them that don't need them, there are lots of folks out here that depend on them.


Pickles
said

If you want a job with free training, job security, free travel and half decent wages then please give this number a call.

1-800-856-8488

Canadian Forces is alway recruiting


TM
said

Shame on you Oshawa people, Stand up for your rights, I read alot about the wages, so they should make that kind of money, My husband works at G.M and his wage allows me to just have to work part time so I can be home raising our children, the way it should be. Why should our kids be raised by daycare centres and babysitters.


Shamaro
said

Although I'm usually against unions and some of the way they do things, I believe that this strike and protest is justified.

GM's truck plant in Oshawa is the most efficient assembly plant in all of General Motors.

With the state of the art technology allows GM to assemble the entire truck with very little labour involved.

Compared to their sister plants in the States, this assembly plant is light years ahead of them in technology.

I have had the opportunity in my career to travel through many, many GM assembly plants and none of them in the States can compare to the efficiency or the Quality that this plant produces.

The Canadian and Ontario governments have paid millions in taxpayers dollars as an incentive to GM to keep things running here in Ontario and to keep investing.

This as far as I can see is an American made decision to put Canadians out of work in GM's most efficient plant. GM will keep truck plants running in the US, but by using twice as many employee's and satisfying Senators and Congressman during an election year down there.

I hope everything works out well for people at the GM truck assembly plant, because they really are quality individuals who make a good solid quality product. Best of luck to all of you.


DRH
said

I watched "Buzz" on Live @ 5:30 last night and the whining that he was doing about it being the Federal Governments responsibility to stop foreign cars coming into Canada, was precious. I'm sure he and all his CAW cronies have forgot that they voted for Dalton, which got them several hundred million of our tax dollars that did absolutely nothing but delay the inevitable. Buzz, you may want to get a head start for the UI line! I hear Dalton is already on his way.


SUNSHINE
said

I went thru that truck plant when it opened and a woman was reading a paper back as she waited for the truck to come so she could put the nut on the end of the bolt. No job skills there. Welcome to the real world.OVER PAID TO SAY THE LEAST.


Rob - British Columbia
said

First let me say that I have worked for a union truck manfacture.

Second let me say that I have never had to work so little to get paid so much.

Is the work repetitive, yes but it's not hard.

My plant was closed down due to the high costs of labor and I lost my job. So I moved on, got more education, and relocated. THATS LIFE.

Even with more education it has taken 8 years to get back to the wage I was makeing at the plant but in retrospect now I see that for my education level at the time and effort I had to put in on the production line I should not have been getting $30 an hour to begin with.


Nate
said

Unions keep busting auto makers for higher wages, which they use to line their own pockets. Time to put some control on unions, or kiss manufacturing goodbye forever.



RRO
said

Oh ya, GM is losing money due to lack of productivity in North America, they can't afford the plant and the way you deal with that is going on strike.

Perhaps that is what got you in this position in the first place. This country does not want to realize we need to create new economy jobs not try to hold onto the old. The Union raised costs so high the companies can't compete. I am suprised it took this long to happen.


Reece
said

I would have bought a domestic car recently but many of those vehicles have the RETRO boxy look. I don't understand why they keep trying to peddle nostalgia even when people don't want them. I want a sleek vehicle with bells and whistles and that's what I bought - with a Japanese brand name. I'm sorry but you guys need to get a new design team in to build cars that people want. Forget the 50's, 60's and 70's!! Those days are over with! Even the baby boomers are turning their attention to practicality over asthetics. Let's move on to 2008...the 50's are dead and besides people are commuting further than ever and with these oil prices you better bring out an efficient car.


Bill
said

This is to Carol Flowers - you are everything that is wrong with a union you feel you are entitled to make big money because you work hard. I will not be one to say that GM workers are lazy but I do know a lot of people who work a lot harder for $15 an hour and don't complain at all. These people pay taxes, contribute to charity, spend money locally as you do. If a business cannot sell its product then they will not be in business it is common sense. Stop whining and take a look at the situation from non GM eyes, it really is not a surprise to the rest of the world that they are not producing trucks and suv's.


Hybrid Hal
said

GM is also laying off in the US. WHY? Because the dinosaurs are still making big gas guzzlers, the sales of which have dropped about 23%. The writing has been on the wall for a LONG time folks. Even though the prices of their SUVs and trucks were lowered by as much as 22%, the public wasn't buying them. WHY? Gas was still going up. GM never faced the music that they should get on board with the innovative and fuel efficient manufacturers like Toyota and Honda. They used scare tactics and 'buy American/Canadian' slogans instead until they put themselves out of business. As for the CAW - they've never been any help and will never make inroads at Honda and Toyota.


Hilary
said

To all the workers laid off: Suck it up like we had to do in Northern Ontario when the forestry industry fell apart. You can manufacture all the light trucks and SUV's you want, but what good is it when nobody wants them.


Tomas
said

Why do people work? I know the case for me is - Work to Live, not live to work. I want a good quality of life, I want to enjoy my time. Union or not, GM, with these high wages... made money in the past. Why have things changed now. The money these poeple make has nothing to do with this. It is a non-issue.


Jason Daniel Baker
said

Understandable frustration as the world economy faces failings in its current market adjustments.

That whole biofuels debacle has really blown up in every ones faces except for the lobbyists that helped make it popular.


alan
said

alan

just wait till you people in southern ontario vote in mr kyoto(dion). mr dion will start implemenmting kyoto and his carbon tax plan...if this happens... watch out people


matv
said

i think alot of the readers are missing the point here, as to why the union is demonstrating ,they have a negotiated contract that the company is now not honouring...it would be the same if you sold your house in february for a certain price just because the housing market has slowed , the buyers cannot lower their offering price..a signed contract is a legally binding agreement


Michelle
said

Wow. The union is making themselves look so stupid. Obviously they don't understand business 101. Supply and demand people. I cannot believe this. How can you demand someone continue business...WHERE THERE ISN'T GOING TO BE ANY???? I feel bad for the people who work there...BUT they have more than a year to find new work...JOB SECURITY DOES NOT EXIST. Adapt....this is pathetic.


PBW
said

Back in the 1980's, British miners went on strike to keep inefficient mines open. Those mines were producing coal at over 100 Sterling per ton, while the world price was 55 sterling. Their mantra was "we have always worked here and should be always able to work here. They even turned down offers of retraining so thay could relocate and gets jobs in other communities. Their response to the offer was "our families have always lived here, why should we move"

I sense a little of the same happening here. Like Arthur Scargill, the well-paid Buzz Hargrove is urging his workers along a path that will result in two things, just as in Britain. First, the plants involved will close anyway, regardless of - or perhaps even because of - their militant action; and second, as a direct result, the union will be split and lose most of its power.

Pehaps Buzz should call Scargill for pointers.


Carrie
said

To Carol Flowers - you said, "Without a union do you think GM would be paying these people $30 an hour, NO!"

That's kind of the point. Do you think a company that isn't making much of a profit can afford to pay these people $30 an hour plus benefits indefinitely?

Yes, the execs are making a killing. Show me a giant corporation where that isn't the case though.

Unions demand better pay and more perks, and then the workers are led into a false sense of security. They come to believe that they're entitled to everything they're getting, even if it's detrimental to their employers. And where does that leave them? Without employers, that's where.


Sharon
said

The negative commentary focusing here on the so called high paid Union members are comments coming from uneducated view points. Jealousy over one's choice of workplace doesn't negate reality, i.e. cost of living, rising fuel costs, benefits for self & family and economy contribution by those very workers in communities such as Oshawa, keeping them alive and sustainable. This is a time Canadians should be demonstrating to the government and standing together, not against one another. When your family members retire and haven't a decent pension to live by or are left without adequate provisions to pay for their medical you might think otherwise. I thank and support my union and all that it stands for in this country ~ Remember the depression days when men fought men for decent working conditions and stepped over one another when another worker would pass out from the heat in our factories. Shall we go back there and start over? Maybe our children will be lucky to receive a grade 8 education ~ Can't wait.
Sharon

Sharon


CR
said

Welcome to the real world. Just like all the other companies that have shut their doors or shut them and moved to India. I dont wish anyone to loose their job but this is the way Canada has become no one is safe and there is no JOB SECURITY any more.
As far as honouring this new contract, they are honouring it up until 2009 the company can close today and no contract can stop that any company can do as they please when they please.


Aaron/Calgary
said

Hopefully these workers won't migrate out West. In Alberta we need folks who are hard working and show intitiative and ingenuity. It's better to hire an 18 year old from Newfoundland who is eager to prove himself than an ex union worker who is looking for security in the next groove he can sqeeze into.


Anne
said

The GM workers are protesting the company's breach of contract- a contract which was signed 3 weeks ago. While the contract basically ensured job security and new product, some benefits were taken away including holidays, break time,drug benefits, future wage increase, etc. While the majority of individuals with limited education work for companies making minimum wage or just above minimum wage, here is a job which pays its workers (some of whom are educated at college and university level) enough money to own a house, raise a family, and contribute to the local economy. Last year, GM Oshawa produced $10 billion worth of product, and paid its employees a fraction of that. GM workers pay income and sales tax (like the majority of us) which contribute to services we all use. The majority of GM workers also own homes, and pay property taxes which contribute to local services. I do not begrudge the workers and their wages. Working on an assembly line is tedious, monotonous, and usually physically demanding work.

For every job lost at the GM plant, 6-7 jobs are lost in the auto industry. Approximately 15,600-18,200 unionized AND non unionized jobs will be lost with the truck plant closure.

GM Oshawa has also won JD Power and Associates Awards for Plant Quality in North and South America in 2002, 2003, 2005 and 2006.


GM has fuel efficient vehicles offered at reasonable prices but has been slow jumping on the hybrid band wagon. I guess that is why GM is building assembly plants in Mexico, India, China. Workers there are non-unionized, do not receive health care benefits, and make just enough money to put food on the table. More money for GM...wonder what the quality will be like?

I shop at Canadian Tire, The Bay, Rona, and Loblaws ( I believe all Canadian-owned companies) as I want to support our economy and the people who work for these companies.

Good luck GM employees.




Shaun
said

I want a truck, a 3/4 ton truck. Am I the person that doesn't work for a construction company that wants A truck?

And no i'm not talking about the trucks from Toyota or Nissan or LOL Honda.

My streets lined with 3/4 ton trucks. I can't walk 15 feet without seeing one, it's quite an impressive sight.

Man I love Alberta!







Well Paid and Over Worked
said

I had to complete a university degree and work for nearly 20 years in a demanding job involving great responsibility and potential liability before I started earning the same money that many GM workers earn right out of high school doing work I could train a chimp to do. It galls me that these people believe they have some inalienable right to earn this kind of money and have job security for almost nothing in return, and producing vehs nobody wants anymore.

In case any of you GM workers out there think you have it rough and this recent termination of your livlihood isn't fair, feel free to pick up a rifle and join me in Afghanistan. The pay is good and the benefits are excellent... the working hours kinda suck and there's always that risk of IED or ambush... but other than that, the job security is sound. We may ask you to actually work for your paycheck though.


The Hawk
said

It amazes me how people can post to a bulleting board like this without a clue. (Must be the security of anonymity.) I certainly do not support strike actions. Most of the time, they are holding someone else's rights hostage in trying to achieve their own purposes. (Usually called "terrorism".) However, some of you people need to inject your comments with a little intelligent forethought.

To Mark:
If the union workers were to "look in the mirror", you expect them to see "legendary gas prices, collapse of the housing in US mortgage business, slowing economy, Liberals and 'Kyoto'"? Splatter your thoughts much?

To pp:
I've been laid off 3 times in my life - all sales jobs - all IT - each time after making quota consistently, year after year. It was always due to corporate restructuring and a decision to eliminate the part of the business I was in. Your formula made me laugh: "Education + Skills + Gumpshun = job security". I have the education (BSc Computer Science & Math). I have the skills and gumption (surpassed quota 22 out of 24 years). What I don't have control of is corporate direction. This caused me to get OUT of IT in 2004. Feel free to enjoy your ride in IT, but care to re-think your formula?

To D.D.:
You think getting rid of unions gets rid of job cuts? Think again.

A final thought:
I guess a better question than "Why do people write such drivel?", is "Why do I keep reading it?"

Searching for intelligent life ... Hello? ... Hello?


Robert
said

I can understand the workers being upset .The truth of it all is the average Family can,t afford these gas guzzlers plus the high payments.


GM
said

Good luck. GM.



MP
said

To Chris:

"And those of you saying "just accept it..." Would you just sit back when you were told you're losing your job? You wouldn't fight, or try to figure something out? Get off the soap boxes you're accusing the GM workers of standing on."

I've been in the IT industry for over 10 years and bounced from company to company... it's a way of life my friend...

You do what is necessary to survive.

Anyone, union or not, who actually believe that your job is secure then you better call a shrink.


Edward in Vancouver
said

I had an uncle who once owned a company and his employees wanted to introduce a union. He fought it tooth and nail and finally when the productivity went down because the employees were disenchanted, the company lost money and he closed it down, so in the end the employees lost their jobs!
80 years ago unions were needed to ensure fair wages and healthy working conditions. People could go to work and lose money if they made a mistake. But today unions are bullies who preach entitlement.
While GM may have renegotiated with the union, the fact is a contract does little good when the company is at risk of going bankrupt.


PG
said

never good when people lose their job. But I think that the union has been the master of this disaster. Buzz and the like have held a pistol to the heads of the big 3 for way too long, and this is the result.


Bluenoser
said

The auto industry has once again made it clear that the front line people mean nothing to them .... and the bottom line of profit. Maybe they should restructure their head offices to save money. It is sad to see so many out of work, but it doesn't help when folks, like Mark, take the opportunity to spew Western propaganda.


James
said

Don't be fooled! Buy Canadian, buy Canadian, buy from the big three. Here's why.

Since the 70's, we have slowly and surely lost automotive sales market share to imports. It's simple. We want Canadian jobs, we have to employ Canadian people and purchase Canadian products workers take pride in building.

Canada is a big country with a harsh climate and long winter where light and heavy duty trucks are not just nice to have, but necessary. We do need four wheel drive trucks.

Personally, I have owned GM cars and have been very pleased with their reliability, comfort, service and mileage.

Be proud, buy Canadian.


Former Laid off Mill Worker
said

It would be nice if GM could set up some re-training.
I had no skills but to work in a sawmill, pushing buttons.
The BC forest industry helped me back in the late 90s (when the forest industry was crashing), get upgraded and into an engineering program when there was word the sawmill I worked in was closing. Now I have a great job with a high salary, with a lot of future potential. I thank the BC forest industry and will never forget it.


Heather
said

Yes I have never bought any other car but G.M. I think we have been seeing this for some time with gas prices. My husband is in construction all the men he works with have trated their big trucks for smaller trucks. G.M. knew in May why did they sign a contract giving them security They can replace the trucks for another Auto after all Sam McLauglin started General motors right here in Oshawa. Lets keep it here. I am tired of the Americans getting their own way by bulling us Canadians


Carolina
said

The new world economy means there are no jobs for life anymore. No job is secure. I've been downsized twice in 7 years due to corporate buyouts and have had to start over. Each time I landed on my feet in a better place. I've learned more,and constantly upgrade my skills to stay competitive at my trade. This leaves me in control of where and how I work.

There is an expression that goes when a door closes, a window opens. Meanwhile, it's hell in the hallway.

I think the GM workers aren't just mourning jobs but a lifestyle. Yea it's sad, change is scary. That gravy train has left the station.


Eve
said

GM Canada lost millions of dollars and thousands of customers due to their greedy pricing policy. Only in the past 6 months or so GM woke up to the fact that Canadians would no longer pay 25% higher for a vehicle than Americans paid. Now GM Canada offers large dollar discounts but it is years too late. Canadians are now paying the price again for GM Canada's greed.


We need 4X4's
said

In an ideal world there would be no trucks but what about the farmer, the construction worker, the welders, pipefitters, plumbers, carpenters and other tradesmen that need their 4X4's to get into rough spots.

How can companies quit making SUVs, there are families that have more than 3 children that require larger vehicles.

We live in a country where the snow can be 3' deep. If it was not for the 4 wheel drive trucks and SUV's there would be a lot of people unable to get to work. When buses are pulled out of service those with the proper vehicle can get to work.

Everyone thinks that cutting out the use of trucks/SUV's is the answer but it is not. Car pooling is. Every company in Canada should on their safety board have a Car Pool posted. Large companies should supply busing from a designated spot to the workplace.

There are a lot of bigger problems than that caused by a vehicle, especially a new one.

Everyone that is cheering for the closure to these plants obviously does not have a family member enployed there. Adding economic hardship to so many is not a solution.

FORD, GM and Chrysler need to be more dilligent and build consumers vehicles that are eco friendly and still safe and gas efficient. With the technology today that does not sound like a stretch.

For those of you complaining about cars/trucks how about shutting off your darn air conditioner in your houses, you are wasting my air space.


Mark
said

It only makes sense to close this plant.

GM produces cars for the people, and not create or keep jobs alive.

The demand for big vehicles, which the factory produces, is on a major decline, and the salaries and benefits the unionized employees recieved are way too high. The high wages don't allow for GM to be competitive in the global market place.

That's just the reality of things.


private sector employee
said

It seems like simple economics...why continue to create the supply if the demand isn't there.
And, businesses are generally in the business of making a profit. If keeping this plant open doesn't make financial sense to the bigger picture, then of course they're going to close it.
And as for the workers who are protesting because they don't want to lose their job - it really is a time for a reality check: JOB SECURITY DOES NOT (NOR SHOULD IT) EXIST!
And don't even get me started on the government hand-outs they've gotten. I'd love it if the gov't subsidized my job, but I live in the real world.


Carolina
said

I learned this the first day at trade school. A GOOD PRODUCT IS ONE THAT SELLS.


JohnKanata
said

To the CAW and Buzz - Suck it up Buttercups, there are no guarantees in life. No one forced you to work there. Everyone's job ultimately depends on "supply and demand". It's never nice to lose your job, but take this opportunity to learn a skill/trade, and become in "demand" again. Welcome to the real world.

To GM - Since the workers have walked off the job, you might as well close the plant down immediately.


Andy Zimmer
said

AAA


I work for Magna and all three north american companies allow less quality parts to go on their vehicles. American quality is poor compared to the Japanese as well as they are gas guzzling vehicles and not wanted in todays economy.


Graham
said

This is certainly a shock after the recent signed agreements.
However, I think that perhaps we should back up a little.
Years ago a Canadian who had worked his way up in the Union (then one union) suggested that GM look at what Toyota was doing with its' recent development of a new 'type' of car.
Both GM and other union executive told him in no certain terms that he was wrong.
Also, the government AND the big three have done nothing -well perhaps token work - on developing fuel efficient cars.
All three manufactirers have the technology - hidden away. Look at the 60-100 mile a gallon carburettor that was hushed up. Look at the mysterious recall of the electric car in California.
Also, do not forget that Harper has done absolutely nothing to encourage fuel efficient cars. Look at the two companies in Canada that manufacture hybrid cars (Halifax, Vancouver and one other) that are NOT allowed to sell their cars in Canada, but sell thousands to the States and Europe. In fact after a report on CBC National one evening re their problems, they got clearance the next day -but must now get permission from EACH province to sell their cars. I beleive the Vancouver company has now been sold to Pakistan.
Also, do not forget how much money inn taxes that the government would lose.
It is all a game of smoke and mirrors.
Will GM return any loans ? Has Bombardier ?
Things will only deterioate I am afraid, they do not care for the little man on the street anymore.


SC
said

To Sharon:

Are you kidding me? It's called working for a living. My husband does not work in a unionized workplace and neither do I. We work 40 hour weeks at half the wage of the unionized workers, and we have to really watch our budget. You snivelling about making a "decent" living is like a spoiled rich kid whining about how much he "needs" to survive. All of the GM workers should have seen the writing on the wall long ago and started putting some of their HUGE wages away for a rainy day. The rainy day is here.

And by the way. I am not uneducated. And we also have to deal with rising fuel costs and the cost of living. Welcome to our world.


Linda in Vancouver
said

If you can't sell the product,you can't keep paying people to make them.But our family used GM trucks for decades ad had no problems with them.To those who simply don't like trucks,I'd like to see how you felt after a few weeks of having no trucks on any road,anywhere.Everything you own,or use has been on a truck at one time or another.
And neither my ex or my father could have made a living without them.
As for fuel,there is not reason,other than taxes, that we should be paying so much more than the USA.In fact, we have more than we need in Canada.We should be buying it from Alberta at world prices,refining it here, and selling it to Canadians first. If lower taxes are simply replaced by higher energy costs,then manufacturing of any kind will continue to decline in Canada.


Neil
said

GM workers to protest for 'as long as it takes'

Ok, so 'as long as it takes'for the housing problem in the US to resolve, for gas prices to drop back to $0.70/litre, a solution to global warning, etc, etc...... HOPE YOU PACKED A LUNCH


Hailey
said

For everyone complaining about the wages that GM workers earn - this has nothing to do with that! GM is not going to continue producing products that do not sell, regardless of the wages that employees are earning. Some seem to think that by cutting wages to $12/hr is going to allow GM to continue to produce trucks and SUVs that simply sit on dealer's lots. That's ridiculous.

For other's that think all GM workers are uneducated and keep mentioning that they need to get some education and find a real job, I think you would be surprised how many workers actually have a college or university degree. Due to the fact that many people could earn a higher wage working at GM then in their own field after graduation, that's exactly what they did. Given the opportunity, I would do the same. The problem now is that these workers have a diploma/degree that is 15 to 20+ years old with no experience in that field. How useful is that going to be in starting a new career?

Instead of criticizing these workers and arguing over facts that many of you don't even understand, you should consider the devastation that these workers and their families are experiencing at the moment.


christine weessies
said

I have read some of the remarks of these uneducated people who know about the economy because they read the paper and about unions because they read the papers. Well let me tell you that these workers deserve every cent that has been bargained for them. They put that money into the communities, they pay more taxes than you less fortunate people. How do you think the economy will flourish if people don't earn a decent living. You think that Flint Michigan is a ghost town just what do you think will happen if GM decides to move all of there products off shore. Oops another ghost town. These things that happen have to do with the corporation and they do make a lot of money off the backs of these workers or they would not be able to pay the massive amounts of money to these exects that they do. WE need a government that will put policies into place for people not for companies to make money and then flee the countries. Have some balls Harper and step up to the plate and do something for the Manufacturing in this country. The workers of the world know what needs to be done but a lot of people have there heads in the sand and most likely don't even vote. I went through a plant closure. We bargained a good agreement that allowed people to relocate and start a new job with the same company. Thank god for unions. Because without us the standard of living in this country would be a hell of a lot lower. Unless of course people think that they are getting paid what they are worth and their employer is just going to share the profits with them because he is good. Reality check please. Proud CAW union member for 36 years.....


John P
said

I am not a fan of the CAW or Buzz Hargrove but this time they have it right. G.M. has a legally binding contract with these workers.

This plant has one of the highest quality standards of all the GM plants. I understand if the vehicle isn't viable anymore with today's gas prices. GM should retrofit the plant and make another vehicle here.

What they will do is build plants in Mexico because of the cheap labour. This is a losing strategy. Mexico makes lousy cars. Audi moved production to Mexico and they ended up moving production back to Germany.

Honda and Toyota build the best mas produced cars in the world and both firms are very profitable. Do you see either of those firms moving production to Mexico? No they build in Japan, US and Canada. They charge more for their cars than Ford/GM/Chrysler and they outsell them. Why? Because the initial cost of the car is only part of the total cost. Repair and maintenance can be huge. Japanese cars require less because they are better built and people are buying peace of mind because they know the cars are reliable.

The other issues at stake if the hundreds of millions of taxpayer money GM has received. McGuinty is a moron, he should have put conditions on that money. One would have been no closing any plants for 10 years.


a retired truck plant worker
said

I am so sick of all the people who attack the workers and what they receive as wages. Most of you have no clue how the workers in the plant work now and that they are not getting any younger and working harder then ever. And I wonder how many of you would cut your wages in half as you are suggesting that GM workers should.

And who will make up for all the tax money that will be lost to our country? Will you, who attack the wages, volunteer to pay more taxes to make up for the loss? I bet you would whine about it.


mottawa
said

This country needs to wake up to the fact that the success of the oil sands is masking the real state of our economy. The media and federal government should pay attention to something called the "dutch disease" (...the apparent relationship between the exploitation of natural resources and a decline in the manufacturing sector combined with moral fallout. The theory is that an increase in revenues from natural resources will deindustrialise a nation’s economy by raising the exchange rate, which makes the manufacturing sector less competitive and public services entangled with business interests.) Once the resource boom is over the real state of the ecomomy is reavealed and in most cases doesn't recover well.

The government has to get off the gravy train and take some decisive action before it's too late.


howard
said

it doesn't matter if its cars or shirts jobs are leaving canada it affects us all. e.g. go to canadian tire and try to find somthing made in north ammerica not just in canada. canadian tire shuold be called china tire.


DC
said

Although losing one's job is always an uncertain time, the reality is that companies like GM have to adapt to the new economic realities. The CAW itself must accept responsibility for the demise of the Big 3. In addition, it is simply perposterous and utterly mystifing that government intervention and subsidies are keeping these jobs alive versus allowing market forces to decide. Taxpayers are simply supporting over paid workers maintain their jobs to produce a product nobody wants. GM and the Big 3 would have left long ago under our oppressive tax scheme, and business killing unions like the CAW were it not for the Canadian taxpayer.


Chris
said

My husband and I have always bought GM products (supporting the local economy). I feel sorry for the many families affected by the closure - but take a look in the Oshawa GM parking lot and see how many cars are not made by GM but are driven by Gm employees!!! Where is their loyalty??


Roger T
said

I'm looking to buy a Toyota Yaris, anyone selling one?

Good on gas and better quality.


Brian
said

I can't believe the whining from the CAW. You over paid big shots did it to yourself! It seems that you have always said that the Big 3 didn't give their employees enough (wages, benefits, etc.), well now you must reap what you have sown. You pushed them to the breaking point.

Why must the government always bail you guys out??
What makes you so special??
Maybe the government should help out the working poor, not the lazy elite who do nothing but complain.

Maybe the CAW needs to re-evaluate their own 'higher ups' (Buzz) and do their own corporate restructuring.




Ron McDonald
said

Global Warming
Torrential Rain
Earthquakes
Tornados
Hurricanes
Flooding
Deforestation
Food chain decline
Animal Extinction
Poverty
130 Million starving

I hope GM stays out of business.


pp
said

To The Hawk:

Oh yes you're right I forgot the most important part of the equation:
Education + Skills + gumpshun + PEOPLE SKILLS = successful job.

Sorry that your BSc is not getting you anywhere, but Sales Jobs are notorious for instability.

There are plenty of jobs in IT if you know where to look. Maybe IT is just not for you... IT just doesn't necessarily mean being a Tech Analyst - the IT field stretchs from Geographical Information Systems to Retail Information systems... etc.

I am hoping the GM workers realise that all they need is a bit of encouragement and training and the willingness to work hard and realize that they will likely NOT be making $40/hr but they can make a good living.

Yours truly, Intellegent Life


Jessica Turner
said

Hey Mark (2nd pearson on the list). I agree with you about most of what you said, legendary gas prices, collapse of the housing in US mortgage business,
slowing economy,
Liberals and 'Kyoto'. But, all those peaple are going to be out of jobs, and most of them may have families. So I ask -you and every body else- this. Have ever had no job (for what ever length of time) and still pay the bills, put a roof over you and your families heads, and food on the table?


Bryce Paup
said

Sorry Folks

I find it devastating to EVEYONES economical future as a result of this closing. But lets face it, all in the bargaining unit were all over GM when the company was strong and profitable. You guys demanded more money, more benefits and other benefits. You took advantage of the companies position in a competitive market. The cost of driving sky rockets and now you have a problem????? All of you in the bargaining unit are the reason why people can't afford a GM vehicle. Its sad that your families welfare is at risk because of your greed. I really hope this works out well, not because of your jobs, but because of the consequences it will have on everyone. So stop being so selfish!


Simon
said

CAW and its members should wake up and smell the coffee. Nobody really wants to buy their vehicles anymore, they're not just fuel inefficient but also plain ugly.


Canadian Kid
said

The Ontario government needs to stop subsidizing a drowning company. GM workers should start looking elswhere, General Motors is clearly a dying animal. Put it down already.


kevin philip
said

Take a walk around the GM employee parking lot in Oshawa. A high number of vehicles the employees drive are NOT even GM. Try handing out the pink slips to those people!! The union has bled the company drive as well...it's now cheaper to go where people are grateful to have a job vs. expensive benefits.


GM Supporter
said

We need to buy Canadian cars to keep the Big Three in business - plant closures, lay offs, etc. - all of this will have an impact on our economy i.e. ripple effect.
This has nothing to do with unions, "fat" pay cheques, etc. Unions exist. This has nothing to do with GM employees making a higher salary - that is what they negotiated. We all had the option to apply for employment with GM - we choose not to. It is unfair to critize the employees.

Our government must stop the import of foreign cars and foreign auto manufacturing in Canada. We must focus on our own Big Three.

I am not a union member and I am not employed in the auto industry. I do however, support our Big Three by only buying/leasing cars manufactured in Canada.

Shame on General Motors for negotiating the most recent collective agreement in a hurried fashion - just to spring this plant closure on its employees. Whatever happened to good faith bargaining?


deacon1
said

James,

Youe live in a dream world...why would I use my hard earned monery, and I mean HARD EARNED...to buy a GM product that will cost me more money to run than other cars???/ Just beacuse you consider it Canadian??? GM's profits go to GM in the USA....GM employes Canadian workers just like....HONDA and TOYOTA. While GM closes, TOYOTA is building a plant just down the road from me...hmmmm


Damian
said

For the longest time the union acted like it had monopoly power over GM, which in a way it did. It got whatever it wanted, because the only option for GM was to shut down operations.
Well, now, GM is shutting down operations, and the union is bitching and moaning, because it's addicted to a world where it gets whatever it wants, and that world is ending.

The union (and all unions elsewhere in the world) needs to realize that businesses operate to make MONEY, to make PROFIT, and don't just exist for the purpose of providing unionized labor with ridiculous pay and benefits, far beyond what the market can support and justify.
Am I happy that so many people will be unemployed? Of course not, it's my tax money which will pay their unemployment benefits, but the tone and the attitude of the union and (some of) the membership make it impossible to have any sympathy for them.


Fellow CAW member Local 2002
said

Good luck my brothers and sisters.


Rick
said

This plant closure is a big hit to Ontario's economy which, when it comes to manufacturing is already in trouble. I agree that wages and benefits as negotiated by the CAW are too high. I agree that GM is a little slow in moving toward products that better meet current market demands. I agree that the price of a barrel of oil and thus a lire of gas is rediculout and unnecessary as dictated by the oil companies. These are three of the main problem areas contributing to the current situation as no single problem is the cause of the auto industry problem. Maybe it is time the CAW, GM and the government worked together as a team and worked out a solution, even if it means making sacrifices.


Shawn
said

Why is McGinty still in power? Because Ontario continues to drink the liberal kool-aid.

How about offering incentives to new green industries and technology. Ontario has a trained workforce and nowhere to put them.

James
said

Do we want a booming economy again like in the 80's when there was a lot of spending and there were beers to go around? It can happen, but is that what we really want?

Just like buying someone a drink, it has spin-offs that stimulate the economy. Pretzels, appetizers, dinners, movies are all possible.

With the production of one GM truck in Oshawa, the worker recieves a union wage which he/she spends at stores, restaurants, entertainment, groceries etc thus producing at least seven spin-off employment opportunities. We all spend a little and with baby steps, we could have the economy like the 80's again. It can happen.

Aaron/ Calgary
said

We bought a GM Pontiac in 1983. It wasn't just a lemom but but a whole lemon tree. We then purchased a 1986 Nissan that was only retired last year with over 300 thosand knms.

Think folks: GM makes a poor quality product today. Think about how that quality will further deteriorate if these disgruntled workers go back on the assembly line.


Gord
said

I grew up in a Northern Ontario mining town and I well remember Dad coming home from work in tears at the treatment he received at work and coming home from union organizing meetings all bloody because company goons busted in with baseball bats.The way uneducated blue collar workers like my Dad, who had few employment options open to him was truly shameful.The union came in representing much needed social change corrected all these injustices and Dad then began receiving generous pay and health benefits and retired in dignity. These unselfish union leaders had their hearts in the right places and were like folk hero's many of whom were fired and blackballed for their beliefs. There were union cheerleaders everywhere.They helped create the middle classes in our country. It was these wages and benefits that enabled Dad to finance my education and enabled me to get the hell out of there. Dad and his new found union created prosperity created options in life for me that he never had.

Through all this they never forgot they, together with their employer, had to stay healthy and competitive in order to keep the good times rolling.

He would be appalled at these fat cat Buzz Hargrove, Sid Ryan and Jack Layton showboaters capitalizing on this latest Oshawa misery pretending to care rather than helping GM who's been hit with this swift thunderbolt make survival changes. They should be unselfishly helping work on survival plans for GM rather than this in your face selfish confrontation. GM exists to produce vehicles, not to perserve unsustainable products and the jobs for those who build these unsustainable products. Times change and it seems CAW needs new leadership and an invitation to Sid Ryan and Jack Layton to butt out on issues that they know little about other than reaping political capital for their own selfish reasons.


Chris
said

I have absolutely had it with people spouting that GM, Ford and Chrysler dont' know how to make fuel effecient cars. That is total BS, and you people spouting this crap don't know what you are talking about. That may have been the case 10 year ago, but now the big 3 make some of the best cars in the world. You people need to do a little research instead of just parroting what other people who think they're intelligent know.

Scott
said

Meanwhile, I am driving home my new Hyundai hatchback today... the one that gets 16 km to the litre. And you wonder why these guys are going to be out of a job.

Every dealer I talked to during my car search told me that truck and SUV sales were way down this year.


SMB
said

SC

There are all types of unionized jobs. You fail to see the forest for the trees.
Workers who are underpaid as you mention and left without choices become angry, unproductive workers. That is well documented.




Mark
said

To GM Supporter: I think that Canadians should buy Canadian built vehicles. Go out and buy a high quality Honda that they build in Alliston.


Dawn
said

Actions following the GM announcement are the result of a corporation which refuses to live up to its contractual obligations and a reflection of a government who continues to sit idly by while workers and there communitites continue to lose good good manufacturing jobs.

Windsor Non-Auto Worker (to Anne)
said

Anne: In your post you mention that you "shop at Canadian Tire, The Bay, Rona," etc., as though this somehow equates to buying Canadian when it comes to automobiles. You're comparing apples and oranges. When you shop at those retailers, you're supporting the retailer alone; not the people who produced the goods, which is what the CAW attempts to push us to do (and by the way, The Bay is now US-owned). If ALL of the products sold at these stores were Canadian-made, your argument may have had merit, but it doesn't.

Regarding buying GM-built vehicles: I have owned four Big 3 built vehicles in my lifetime; all of which lived up to the used car guide cautions, as each cost me thousands in various problems. Since then I have purchased two Toyotas; both were built in Canada, therefore SUPPORTING the workers in Canada who manufactured them, and yet CAW members here think nothing of screaming at me for driving what they erroneously refer to as an "import". Other than routine maintenance, these vehicles have been 100% reliable. And the workers building Toyota products seem to be quite content, without belonging to the CAW.

To those who maintain that "one lost GM job equals X number (usually 6 or 7) other jobs", I would like to see the study that you attribute this mythical statistic to. While there can be no doubt that society will be impacted, I'm comfortable in theorizing that 2,500 lost jobs does not equate to 17,500.

A
said

Congrats Ontario, you've just been Mcguintyed yet again. When are you all going to wakeup and stop voting for this guy and others like him. When he made the reckless decision to subsidize an industry to the tune of Millions of taxpayers dollars, does he even think what is involved and whether the product or service is something that will be sustainable over the long term? If the banks did this without looking at a Business plan, they'd all go belly up in a heart beat.

Debra
said

How sad that people would have such a negative feeling toward the Union workers. I live in Oshawa, bought my house in Oshawa and raised my family here. My husband has spent almost 30 years working in the auto industry allowed us to buy that house and raise our children and appreciate every pay cheque. I have worked in jobs where I worked my butt off for minimum wage and the taxes I paid were no way close to the taxes my husband paid. Shame on you for resenting the fact that someone makes more money than you. Do you resent doctors, dentists, lawyers as much. They don't do the physical labor that the auto workers do but they make much more than the $40.00 (that includes benefits by the way, for which the auto workers pay more tax) If I worked in a company for my lifetime I would think that my pay cheque should reflect the years I put in. If you won't buy Canadian products and can't support the Canadian economy then your opinion is less than valuable.


Leon
said

These workers are militant! A mere thousand or so laid off and there is such a fuss. What about the poor tech sector workers who are laid off by the tens of thousands (nortel alone). They don't get a tenth of the coverage that the auto workers get and no one is advocating for them.


Get to work people!
said

To those of you who say GM should have seen it coming ie fuel prices sky rocketing. Did You? If I did, you bet I would have "stocked up" on Oil Stocks and I would think GM would as well. Alot easier to work with that than the CAW.
It's so easy sitting on the sidelines under the veil of anonymity this forum allows us.


Tired GM Worker
said

I see that there is a lot of negative comments. Why? I think people are very jealous of the GM workers. I have worked on the line for 23 years and I hope to make it for the next 7 so I can retire. You see working on the line is talking its toll on me. My feet, hands, elbows are starting to wear away. Taking lots of medications to relieve the pain. Do I deserve to make the money that do? YES! I don’t see people complaining about their politicians, police, fire depts personnel making lots of money. If it starts in the manufacturing sector taking a 50% pay cut pretty soon it will hit the public sector too. Besides as the law goes, I have to maintain the life style that my wife and family have become accustom to and working for minimum wages just won’t cut it. Oh by the way, when or if I get to retire in 7 years you whiners can have my line job for lets say $10.00 per hour. I bet you wouldn’t make it to the end of the week. Just ask some of the students who work there for the summer. They would probably say if it wasn’t for the money there is no way they would work there…….


John Byrne
said

John GM Worker
I have been reading the comments made by people, and am amazed at the narrow minded views being expressed. One would think that before you comment on something, you would do your research. As an employee of GM for almost 32 yrs. I have nothing to appologize for when it comes to what I recieve in wages and benefits. GM would not give them if they couldn't afford them. And not that it's any of your business, but if you must know, our wages and benefits only make up 2 to 4% of the cost of building the vehicles we produce. Oshawa is a world class auto facility with intellegent and hard working employees who, over the years have been responsible for generating billons of dollars in profit for GM. They have also been responsilbe for giving millons of those (as you would put it) unwarrented wages to various charities. The bottom line is this, do your research before you comment on something you know nothing about.


Elaine wife of retired GM worker
said

I sit and read all the comments about how a GM employee has such an easy job working for this company. Try walking in some of the employees shoes. You do the same job day in and day out. Once you clock into work you are locked in the only way out is through the guard station. You think that all the benefits are top of the line think again. For example vision is only covered for $255.00 for once every two years. The Dental for false teeth they only pay half if you stop to think about it dentures last a long time. Try replacing these things when you get the Pension that is offered. Some of you people should try walking in the shoes of an GM employee. The foremen are constantly dogging you. Sure I will admit there are some that do have easy jobs and what person wouldn't like a job like that but that is not always the case in GM. We don't any coverages for anyone that has serious medical problems such as Diabetes when you should have special foods for exaple fresh fruit, vegetables and buy sugar free products.

You may think life is easy working for GM but its not and don't think for one minute that the pensions are top of the line because they are not.


sassha
said

GM blew it 10 years ago, it could have being a world leader by now. when it introduced it plugin eletric car called the evo.. it went 120km/h it got 120 km to the charge with lead acid batteries, then they switched over to NiM batteries and the got +200 km to the charge. then they were going to do the switch to lithium polymer batteries over +300 km to the charge. the project was stopped dead and every car was recalled and destroyed.. ask your self why ??? it not because they could not sell them they had waiting lists of 1000's of people -- and every owner loved them... it the same reason now why you do not see plugin eletric cars being sold.. and probably will never really see them sold for years to come by the major automakers - because the auto industry is tided to oil and they do not want to break that cycle of consumerism of gas and oil and service to upkeep these fuel driven cars..


Share with your social Network:

 

Advertisement

Contest

User Tools

About the tools

Need to get in touch with CTV? You can email the CTV web team using the 'Feedback' button.

Share it with your network of friends

Share this CTV article or feature with your friends. Click on the icon for your favourite social networking or messaging system, and follow the prompts.

Share this article with Facebook

Share this article with Digg

Share this article with Newsvine

Share this article with delicious

Share this article.
Send Email

Share this article with Twitter

Share this article with StumbleUpon

Share this article with Reddit

Share this article with Yahoo! Buzz

Most Talked about Stories

The chance of the destruction of our planet is very very small with this collider, but who are these people to decide what risks are acceptable for all of mankind? It puts me at unease and adds to my anxiety. CERN acknowledges that there are miniscule risks -- they admit to it so please spare the convoluted retorts.

kc-bby

Hadron Collider back in action after year of repairs