CTV News | NATO should double troops in Afghanistan: report

Top Stories -   

NATO should double troops in Afghanistan: report

Viewer

CTV News Video

CTV News: Roger Smith explains the bullish report
CTV Newsnet: Steven Staples, Rideau Institute
Mike Duffy Live: Experts discuss whether the Afghan mission needs additional troops to be successful
CTV Newsnet: Norine MacDonald, The Senlis Council
CTV Newsnet: Bob Rae responds to the report

Font-size:      Share  Print  Comments(43)

CTV.ca News Staff

Date: Wed. Nov. 21 2007 10:33 PM ET

A new report is calling on NATO to double its troop levels in Afghanistan to 80,000 soldiers.

The report by the Senlis Council -- an international think tank with an office in Ottawa -- also argues that resurgent Taliban now have a presence in about half of Afghanistan and could threaten Kabul in 2008.

"We can't defeat the Taliban just by fighting (with a) small army in Kandahar," Almas Bawar, a Senlis Council spokesperson, told CTV Newsnet's Mike Duffy Live.

"We need more troops so we can stop the bombing (of) villages. It will decrease civilian casualties. In the meantime, we'll have more forces to fight insurgents (such as the) Taliban on the ground in Kandahar, where they are taking district after district each week."

Senlis's new security assessment report is based on field research conducted over the past month.

The group called for the following:

  • Doubling NATO troop levels to 80,000
  • Remove all caveats constraining troop deployment
  • Expand the fight by moving into Pakistan and attacking insurgent bases there -- with the Pakistani government's permission

"The Taliban have established firm roots across the border in Pakistan. President Musharraf has been unable to deal with these bases, and as a result it is impossible to stop the growth of the insurgency in Afghanistan," said Norine MacDonald, president and lead researcher of the Senlis Council.

"NATO troops in Pakistan are therefore urgently required to quell this growing threat, and ensure that this area is closed down as a home base for the Taliban and al Qaeda," she added.

Musharraf has not allowed U.S. troops to enter Pakistan in pursuit of al Qaeda suspects.

He is fighting a growing insurgency in the so-called tribal areas like North and South Waziristan. The New York Times reported last week that despite Musharraf's declaration of emergency rule, the Taliban have increased the territory they hold in those areas and are expanding into new areas.

On NATO troop numbers, MacDonald told CTV Newsnet that "Canada is doing more than its fair share (in Afghanistan)" and praised the job this country's soldiers are doing there.

However, other countries have to both increase their troop numbers and allow them to fight, she said.

Defence Minister Peter MacKay dismissed the Senlis report, saying it was "not credible."

But Bob Rae, the Liberals' foreign affairs critic, said the report should be taken seriously.

With the porous border between Afghanistan and Pakistan -- and with a recent UN report indicating that suicide bombers were coming from Pakistan -- "the security situation is obviously very much a concern," he told reporters in Ottawa on Wednesday.

"I think it's important for Canadians to come to grips with just how tough the situation is."

Military analyst Col. Mike Capstick told Mike Duffy Live that the Senlis report is on the right track, although not entirely correct in its analysis.

"I think an extra 40,000 (NATO troops) may be too many, and I'm a bit concerned that they didn't talk very much in the report about training the Afghan national security forces," Capstick said.

'Combat aid', narcotics

Senlis wants to see "combat aid agencies" established in the south of Afghanistan, thus putting the British and Canadian militaries in charge of aid delivery.

"The delivery of food and development aid by the British and Canadian militaries would be a huge boost to the hearts and minds campaign of both governments in southern Afghanistan," MacDonald said.

"This would be an excellent counter-insurgency strategy -- strengthening ties with the local communities, which is the only viable way to defeat the insurgency in Afghanistan."

Senlis has long supported encouraging Afghan farmers to grow opium poppies but for the production of medical morphine, which it claims is in short supply globally.

As part of its Poppies for Medicine initiative, something the European Parliament endorsed last month, Senlis outlined specifications for a pilot project to test the benefits of legal morphine production by Afghan farmers.

The U.S. government wants to see the poppy crop controlled by aerially spraying herbicides -- something Afghanistan's President Hamid Karzai opposes.

"Chemical spraying of farming communities would mean we lose any hope of ever winning back the hearts and minds of the Afghan people. It would spell utter disaster for NATO's stabilization mission in the country," said Jorrit Kamminga, Senlis's Paris-based head of policy research.

Last week, the UN Office on Drugs and Crime said the value opium production in Afghanistan is equivalent to about 53 per cent of the country's legal economic output.

Antonio Maria Costa, the agency's executive director, called on NATO to take a more active role in counter-narcotics operations.

"Since drugs are funding the insurgency, NATO has a self-interest in supporting Afghan forces in destroying drug labs, markets and convoys. Destroy the drug trade and you cut off the Taliban's main funding source," he said.

Comments are now closed for this story

The Big Jay
said

I think its about time to drop the proverbial "HAMMER" and finish this job move into Pakistan increase troop levels and finish the job that was started. It will take a combined effort from all of NATO and should be done swiftly and with great force possibly three times what is there right now.


Lou
said

Three times what is there now...come on!! It would take a lot more than that. Look at the numbers that the Soviets had.

Unfortunately, western society does not have the stomach to do what is necessary. I argee that the effort should switch to PAK. But officially, they are an ally of the GWOT so that will never happen.


Don J
said

It's not like the Taliban are breeding in the physical sense... the numbers are growing because more people are joining them and why? Because humans will support a corrupt military group of their own ilk before supporting a corrupt military operation of a foreign country. WE (NATO) are creating the Taliban. WE (NATO) are making them stronger. And we'll continue to do so until we address that situation and find another method to diffuse the violence. Too bad most of what we hear over here is propaganda. And too bad most people who read this propaganda are so afraid to admit that's what it is that they will fight against it and join the propagandists the EXACT way more Afghanis are joining the Taliban to fight the foreign occupation of their country.


Greg from Kitchener
said

I agree, into Pakistan will be important to help defeat the taliban.
Doubling the force will also be a great idea, but should be done by other NATO countries and not the U.S. as they are doing most of the work In Iraq and Afghanistan.


Robert
said

As Canadians I think we need to send a message to the Afghans that yes we will commit to you rebuilding and securing your country, but you need to install the same effort and not allow your country to fall into the hands of the enemy. We need to stop making this about politics, because it is costing real lives and that goes beyond trying to win swing votes!!!


Bruce
said

This problem will be of no concern to Canadians because the oppostion parties will vote to have us leave these desperate people in their time of need.

Derek
said

Invade Pakistan?? A key US ally in the "war on terror"??

Please..time for a reality check.


Julia
said

The Islamic community is looking at western involvment as an attack on Islam. We have to show the Afghan and Pakistani people that we are there to help them. There does need to be a drastic increase in NATO troops so that the Afghan people can see that we can hold the ground after the Taliban has been forced out of their community. Not leaving after a fight and the Taliban re-establishing itself.

Destroying the poppy crop is a western PR scam by politicians. "oh look we are fighting drug trafficing!" To the Afghan farmer when you burn his crop you are taking his livelihood and food from his family. This is why ISAF has nothing to do with poppy eradication. If we could give them an alternative that makes as much money such as harvesting for medicinal purposes would be the best route.

Moving into Pakistan, again, will give the impression that we want to control the Arab world and that Pakistan is just next on our list. Tightening border security with more troops and working with the Pakistani military with airstrikes on key Taliban facilities.


DK
said

You can't win a war being 'politically correct', you need to bring down that proverbialy "HAMMER". How do you think we won WWII? We bombed Germany and Japan back to the stone ages. We firebombed cities, we leveled entire villiages with artillery, hell we even nuked Japan. We killed everyone. That's the ONLY way to win a war.


Denise
said

People, please remember that you have to take it with a grain of salt. It's the Senlis Council, after all. This is the same group that said CIDA wasn't making a difference in the lives of Afghan citizens after visiting, what, 3 hospitals???

Greg from Kitchener
said

Derek: You really think Pakistan is an Ally? they may say they are, but evidence shows that the Taliban is hiding in Pakistan, then coming across to fight.

Andrew McFarlane
said

Senlis's new security assessment is bang on. Now all we have to do is convince all Nato countries it's the right thing to do, and get it done.


A Soldiers Dad

Lindsay Ontario.


mike
said

I strongly agree that we need to eliminate the training bases in pakistan. The taliban fight all summer and go back to Pakistan in the winter when it's too cold to fight. As a soldier who fought in kandahar I saw this first hand, if we take away their ability to "re group" and hit us fresh in the spring that gives us more of an advantage.

ray edmonton
said

For all the big mouths on this board:
Join the army and go over there".
BTW I've been there twice and we will never win.


Ottawa Man
said

I don't mean to sound pessimistic. Reality check .... History is the best tool for predicting the future. The Red Army (Soviets) failed in Afghanistan. (keep in mind, the Red Army soldiers did not even have to comply with any international nor any rules of engagement with their enemies). Cheers.


GW
said

It amazes me to see how people and governments think that we’re going to be able to complete some glorious mission over there even with a mountain of historical evidence to the contrary.

The Israelis couldn’t do it in Lebanon, the Russians couldn’t do it in Afghanistan, the US and Britain aren’t doing it in Iraq and that’s not even the tip of the iceberg.

G. R. Warren
said

I have been to Afghanistan three times, about a year apart each time. We see spin from various interest groups but the ground truth is that things are improving slowly. Creating the conditions so that they can choose between a better life and the repressive Taliban is the only way to rid that area of Taliban.


Cheryl
said

In order to accomplish this task, Pakistan has to get onboard!!! If not, nothing will accomplished.



Elly
said

Why should our troops and the US troops always be the part of NATo who put their lives on the line in the dangerous areas??
All of NATO should step up to the plate and stop being a bunch of cowards, some not even allowed out at nights!
It should be revamped and the mission for nato
should be "rotation" so the same nato troops are not always in the dangerous areas.these countries have huge populations-Pakistan-165 million,
Afghanistan-32 million
Iran 65 million and Iraq
about 29 million. Most of these countries are the size of ONE of our provinces and when you think of our whole country at 32 million those figures are staggering!!While a lot of them are really good people the population of these countries is worrying b/c the bad guys stick guns in their kids hands at 12 and Musharraf gives the insurgents and radicals safe haven, while receiving billions of dollars from the US etc and why b/c he is simply a dictator in disguise who holds the world hostage so to speak with the nuke cards he holds and b/c of that he is all we have bewteen us and the nukes. Bottom line is, this threat is not going away any too soon.



Anne M
said

I agree with DK, we need to bomb and beat them into submission at ALL costs, then we will win. That is how we won WW2, and we had many years of peace after.


JDS
said

Canada, Britain and the US have carried the load on this. It IS time that NATO stepped up to the plate and put some muscle, both politically and militarily, to this problem. However, as history has taught us, don't count on France, Italy and Spain to get going when the going gets tough.

Bombing them back to the stone-age will have little effect...they are already in the stone-age. Perhaps a Marshall Plan is in order; overwhelming military and economic presence for 50 years. It seemed to have turned Germany and Japan around and eliminated both those fascist threats permanently from the global security situation.


Russell
said

If you read the history of the Vietnam war, the general in charge of the Tet offensive saw the entire ordeal as a failure until he realized that the western media had reported it differently. I cannot help but see the similarity here. The Taliban are spread out because they are losing in the south where they originally were concentrated. They cannot muster large scale attacks with any convincing force and the lives of many many Afghans is improving. I think in hindsight we will see that the current tactics are that of a Taliban force that is losing hope and losing battles and it has been interpreted by the western media as something completely different.


B. Gray
said

All interesting points of view in the comments here, and now I'll share mine.

1) There has to be an increase in troops in Afghanistan, period. To hand this back to the Taliban is to hand them their victory over all of the Superpowers; we will watch their attacks multiply as well as their numbers grow.

2) If you invade Pakistan, you could stop the Taliban OR you could destabilize (completely) a country with Nuclear weapons. Beyond that if NATO goes to war with Pakistan, then I believe you will see the start of WWIII. It would not take much for Iran to be allied with yet another nation under attack, and then you have a fight across Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan & Pakistan. Which side would the other countries in the region support? Dangerous situation.

3) As much as we can believe that WWII lead to years of peace afterwards, in many aspects it too only lead to more war. The UN carved up the middle east, and that has only fueled conflicts and wars throughout that region ever since. The Korean war was the US versus Russia & China through North & South Korea - and that almost lead to WWIII. Same with Vietnam - communism vs Capitalism - West vs. East. Big players involved, and not always as "coldly" as we are lead to believe.


M
said

I would love to hear your opinions if we were fighting this war on our own home turf. It's nice to know that you wish this on the innocent people caught in the middle. This could be you and your loved ones.
"...kill them all...it's the only way to win"

Gern Blansten
said

“No nation can donate liberation to another nation. Liberation should be achieved in a country by the people themselves.”
- Malalai Joya, member of the Afghan parliament


Doug Daum
said

double D
One of those questions that makes you wonder...has anyone figured out where the Taliban are getting their weapons from, the Russians only left so much, so which country)s) are supplying the guns, RPG's, etc.


hollinm
said

It's interesting that Senlis comes out every couple of months to denounce the war in Afghanistan in some shape or fashion. If Nato needs more soldiers that is up to Nato. Who are these people who think they know the answers to everything militarily? Maybe they should start running the war and let the commanders on the ground come home. Obviously they don't know what they are doing. Give me a break. Armchair quarterbacks are not what is needed. Besides the Manley committee will report and the HofC will make a decision and then what will the pacifists and naysayers do then? Oh I know they are fighting in Darfur and we aren't doing enough. Yikes.


ance
said

The most important battle is on the "hearts and minds" front.

It is the average Afghan citizen that has the greatest potential to improve or destroy the long term stability of their nation.

We need to do several things to help us on this front.

1. Have greater respect for innocent Afghan lives during armed conflicts. They are not going to accept that it is OK that a coalition air raid killed 8 children because they also got 10 Taliban. It doesn't matter whose fault this is...it only matters that innocents died and we were involved. Telling these desperate people that we are killing them because the Taliban are deliberately putting civilians in harms way is just empty words to someone mourning their children. We need to do more to prevent civilian casualties.

2. Tell the U.S. to keep out with the agent orange and offer poppy farmers contracts to produce legitmate medical products. Some may still farm for illegal purposes but at least we will be offering some alternative and I'm sure many will comply as long as they can feed their families.

3. Stop supporting warlords and others that are no better than the Taliban. Let's be more sure about who we are calling "friend" at this point in time. Some of these people will not long support us once it no longer serves their narrow purposes and they will not really contribute to a positive future for Afghanistan.



AGB
said

This is nothing more than sensationalist tactics on the part of said 'think tank.'

More troops are needed yes, but the Taliban having the capability of gaining control of Kabul.... where has journalism gone to, and when can we expect stories that hold facts and are worth reading to return?


NCL
said

There is an awful lot of misconception and revisionist history in this world and it is evident here.

For example, Julia thinks Afghanistan and Pakistan are Arabic. They are not.

Another example is GW where he thinks Israel was in Lebanon to force a regime change when the reality of it was they entered Lebanon to create a buffer zone to stop attacks on the homeland and drive out Hezbollah guerrilas. On top of this, GW believes that the Soviets were in Afghanistan fighting for the same causes we are, fighting an unsupported enemy even. Again, simply not the case.

No wonder people disapprove of the mission, they are so blind and ignorant as to what goes on and what history demonstrates. No amount of wishful thinking is going to change reality. Plenty of wishful thinking will cloud people's perceptions of reality however.


Faramir
said

I agree that if we are prevented from going into Pakistan then we need to keep troops in Afghanistan for the next 50+ years. We can never allow Afghanistan to become a haven for terrorists again.

By the way WE are not creating the Taliban. Pakistan is a poor nation and the only way to have children educated is to release them to the Islamist run schools, who on top of their ABCs, teach JIhad.


Tom Langford
said

You are suppose to learn from history!? Going by many of the comments here we've learned very little from Vietnam nor the Russians try in Afghanistan!

This war is un-winnable fighting it this way time to get out!

HINT!!!: You cannot fight and win a gentlemans war especially when the enemy is not visable time to get serious OUT GET OUT!


EW
said

I agree with ance's last point.. Tho I personally don't believe this war will ever end.. for numerous reasons one of the main being "War means Money".. My question is how many countries need to be involved before it can be called a world war?


David Dawson
said

Greg From Kitchener, the US gov't is the very reason why Afghanistan is in the remaining mess after NATO went in to remove the Taliban. You would think in the 21st century logical Western Democratic Govt's would complete the job in Afghanistan before invading Iraq. Can you ask me this question How come our courageous Canadian soldiers in the dangerous South part of Afghanistan with a total of 40,000 Nato and US soldiers combined in the rest of Afghanistan, have no additional troops from the US army, after the whole world knew that the former Regime in Afghanistan supported the 9/11 attacks (not Iraq). While 160,000 US soldiers are still in Iraq in a mess that they have created in Iraq, instead of having at least 50,000 of those 160,000 in Iraq helping to finish the job that should have been taken care of 1st and foremost?


Uwe Warkholdt, Elliot Lake, Northern Ontario
said

This is a good example about how the USA dropped the ball and left everyone else to complete their job. If the forces that were used in Iraq was used to squash the Taliban and al Qaeda, things would have been easier. Iraq could have waited. After all Iraq did not attack the USA on 9/11, but al Qaeda did. Remember the Taliban Government protected al Qaeda.

When the USA wanted to attack Iraq instead of finishing their job in Afghanistan first, the rest of the nations should have given the ball back to them. After all the UN Inspectors said Iraq had no weapons of mass destruction. But then again, I am ashamed to say it, but I believe that Iraq has oil and Afghaniston has none. After thousands of people were murdered in cold blood on 9/11 what a horrible thing to believe. However, I cannot help but wonder.


Jen
said

AS LONG as the western world with negative signs and protests against our troops in afghanistan or elsewhere, terrorists terrorisms -and their atrocities will CONTINUE to grow.

WE MUST SUPPORT OUR TROOPS-WE MUST DO SO BY CONDEMNING THE TALIBAN AND THEIR ATROCITIES-

CONSTANT FAVOURITISM AND CONCERN FOR THE TALIBAN's RIGHTS TO FAIR TREATMENT AND NOT TO THE INNOCENT PEOPLE, ONLY TELLS THE TALIBAN THAT WE DON'T CARE ABOUT THE INNOCENT PEOPLE' RIGHTS TO A 'FREE LIVE' SO WHY SHOULD THE TALIBAN STOP KILLING AND THE MORE YOU DEMAND THE TROOPS HOME INSTEAD OF SUPPORTING THEM, AGAIN, THE TALIBAN WILL DO THE JOB FOR YOU BY SENDING THE TROOPS EITHER IN A COFFIN OR MAIMED.

WE MUST SUPPORT THE TROOPS AND NATO FORCES WE MUST HELP THEM BY SHOWING POSITIVE ACTION.
NO MORE NEGATIVITY FROM THE POLITICIANS MEDIA,(THIS IS HOW TERRORIST BREED AND LIVE BY).

THE PEOPLE OF AFGHANISTAN ARE COUNTING THE HOURS BEFORE THE BLOODBATH IN THE ARENA TAKES PLACE.
Please do not this happen again.

God Bless all troops, May He continue to give them the inner strength and Will to carry on to free His people from terror.


Jim in the West
said

The West has lost the will to win...the will to do what is necessary to achieve victory.

If we employed the same bizarre "Rules of Engagement" that Western troops are currently governed by, we would have lost WWI and WWII. Battles are fought by soldiers, but wars are fought by people. When one side or the other is sufficently beaten, the war is over, and we move on to the rebuilding.

As much as it angers memebers of my family, we understand why Germany firebombed Coventry, attacked civilian transports in the Atlantic, and tried to pound London - a civilian city - in to dust. They were trying to break the people.

As much as it saddens members of my family, we understand why we firebombed Dresden, and why we nuked Japan. We were fighting to win, and we did, because the the people on the other side of the line couldn't withstand the punishment.

The West has forgotten the fundementals of war, and for that I am truly afraid.


GW
said

These radicals live for war and conflict and have an endless supply of followers ready to give their lives for the cause. Don’t even think about going up against them unless we’re willing to go all the way like WWII.

The fact is what we're currently doing is exactly what they were hoping for. Provoke the squeamish west into a conflict against us. Stir the pot (change the status quoi in the Middle East), create kayos and when the west has had its fill and backs out we’ll come out on top.

God bless our troops for doing such a great job but our government needs to wake up. We can’t get into these things at half mast. It’s all or nothing.



Aaron
said

Don J we are taking multiple approaches at trying to get rid of the Taliban. We are fighting them, but at the same time trying to promote the Afghanis' welfare so they themselves can make a decision if they want to live under Taliban rule, or a more liberal culture. We are the same. Some people are hard core right wing, and some are hard core left in Canada, we all make our own political decisions. You are right that we are making Taliban, because we are making it possible for their right to choose between Taliban or Karzai; whereas they had no choice before. To those who choose to join the Taliban, they choose to go against us, because we are there to support the Afghan government. You are spreading your own propaganda trying to promote dissent so the mission fails.

To a different poster: Numbers do matter. If you don't believe numbers matter, then you believe Rambo could do it all himself. There is a collossal difference between a brigade, a division or even an army.



David
said

G.R. Warren, very well put. If you provide people with a better option, they will take it. If the option is support the Taliban or death, the choice is easy.


Kevin
said

Get rid of the Forward Operating Bases and integrate rifle companies into the large towns. When we live among them they will trust and work with us. Next would be to smash the training camps in northern Pakistan to stop the flow of insurgents.

Just my opinion, I got back from there in august.


Gary B
said

Three times the force for a quick victory is not reasonable. But if NATO honestly deployed as if they were defending their own it would be an easy victory. Lou, the Soviets were completely incompetent, if we had known there would have been no Cold War.


Chris
said

Of course we need to double the # of troops! We need to crush the evil Taliban, and prevent them from gaining power once more! I hope Canada contributes, for its the right thing to do, but so should all other NATO countries at the same time (with the exception of the USA, which already have a very large presence over there). If that doesn't work, then its time to drop "the bomb"...anything to stop the terrorist-harbouring Taliban from regaining power.


Share with your social Network:

 

Advertisement

Contest

CTV News

Canada in Afghanistan

Canada in Afghanistan

The latest news, photos and interactives from Canada's mission in Afghanistan.

Janis Mackey Frayer

Janis Mackey Frayer

A long way to the exit: Training the Afghan police force

Exit Strategy

Exit Strategy

What's the real plan for Canada's 2011 exit strategy?

Canada's new ambassador to Afghanistan, Bill Crosbie, visits Sayad Pacha School near Kandahar Airfield in this Sept. 8, 2009 photo. (THE CANADIAN PRESS/Bill Graveland)

CTV.ca Exclusive

Janis Mackey Frayer sits down with Canada's new ambassador in Afghanistan.

Petawawa

Petawawa

Two-part series on Canadian actor, director and playwright Christopher Morris.

Bios and Pictures

Casualties

Canadian Casualties

We remember those who lost their lives in Afghanistan since the mission began in 2002.

In Pictures

Hockey night in Kandahar

Hockey night in Kandahar

Hockey night in Kandahar? Soldiers let off steam playing desert ball hockey.

Helping conflict victims in Kabul

Helping victims in Kabul

A Red Cross orthopedic centre gives new hope to disabled Afghans in Kabul.

Corrections Canada

Corrections Canada

Corrections Canada and Canadian Forces reconstruct and train at an infamous Afghan prison.

After the surge

After the surge

A look at life in Afghanistan after the U.S. troop surge.

User Tools

About the tools

Need to get in touch with CTV? You can email the CTV web team using the 'Feedback' button.

Share it with your network of friends

Share this CTV article or feature with your friends. Click on the icon for your favourite social networking or messaging system, and follow the prompts.

Share this article with Facebook

Share this article with Digg

Share this article with Newsvine

Share this article with delicious

Share this article.
Send Email

Share this article with Twitter

Share this article with StumbleUpon

Share this article with Reddit

Share this article with Yahoo! Buzz