CTV News | Newlywed wants option to take spouse's name

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Newlywed wants option to take spouse's name

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CTV News: Genevieve Beachemin with the debate
CTV Newsnet: Maria Battaglia, CJAD radio host

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CTV.ca News Staff

Date: Fri. Aug. 10 2007 11:14 AM ET

There are renewed calls for women to be allowed to take their husband's last name upon marriage in Quebec, with one Ontario-born newlywed challenging Premier Jean Charest to change the provincial law.

Quebec has prohibited women from taking their spouse's name since 1981, but many young women today want to have the choice to do so, family law experts say.

The Ontario-born Caroline Parent, who lives in Gatineau, is among those frustrated by the long-standing legislation. The 27-year-old lives in Quebec with her new husband Karl Lamirande, but was appalled when informed she could not take his last name.

"One day we're going to start a family and I would love to share the same name as my future children," she told CTV News.

Parent has written a letter to Charest demanding an explanation.

"I outlined the fact that I thought it wasn't fair that women in Quebec don't have a choice in the matter," she said.

When the marriage law was created, it was hailed as a triumph by feminists and equality rights activists.

"It was seen as extremely progressive at the time," said Robert Leckey, who teaches family law at McGill University.

"I don't think feminists of the day imagined that 25 years later people would be complaining that they don't have the choice to be traditional."

In other provinces, a woman can begin using her husband's name after marriage. Changing government documents is also an easy task with a provincial marriage certificate.

In Quebec, women are sometimes allowed to have their name changed, but the director of civil status must give approval. Reasons to grant the change include names that are difficult to spell or pronounce, or names that are mocked or that have been made infamous.

Young women want option

Parent is among a growing group of traditional and young women who want the choice to take their partner's name, says Maria Battaglia, an accredited family and international mediator and radio host.

"I'm very surprised that no one has raised the issue of the constitutionality of not giving a woman a right to choose whatever name they wish," she told CTV Newsnet.

"To my knowledge there was never any debate -- it was just given as a fact of Quebec life."

The civil law reform took place shortly after the creation of the Quebec Charter of Rights.

Battaglia says many women are contacting her to see how they can change their last names.

"What I tell people is on all your legal documents, use your maiden name ... but in all social settings -- your children's schools, even your credit cards, anything else you're doing -- you should be able to use your husband's name," she says.

"There is a choice in terms of what you're using socially but there are no options when it comes to legal recourse."

With a report from CTV's Genevieve Beauchemin

Please Add Comments( )

Don K
said
0 0

If Caroline Parent is so concerned with having the same last name as her children, why don't they take her last name? After all, she's the one who will carry them for 9 often-uncomfortable months and then give birth. Why shouldn't they take the mother's name?


KJ
said
0 0

Wake up Quebec. Obviously that law needs to be revisited. How appalling that Quebec insists on being so far out of touch with the rest of the world. Good luck with your battle Ms. Parent!


DJ
said
0 0

Of course she should be able to take her husband's name. We don't need to confuse our kids anymore. I guess the feminists don't think of all the real issues.

Lorrie
said
0 0

How could anyone have considered this law to be forward thinking, when it was created??? Forward thinking, is giving people the choice......whether it's giving mom's name to the kids, or the husband taking on his wife's name too!


NR
said
0 0

The women should be given the choice and not forced to keep or change their last name if married.


Geraldine
said
0 0

I live in Ontario, and I carry the last name of my mother and my daughter carries the same last name as well. My son, on the other hand shares his last name with his father. No biggie, what did Shakespeare say "What's in a name?"...


Patricia Foster
said
0 0

The Quebec Charter of Rights should allow for a woman to choose which name she wants to go by. This is the essence of freedom. Legislating otherwise is contradictory to our freedom. Feminists want "choice" enshrined in this country, yet this legislation is putting the lie to that. And why are those women who want a more traditional lifestyle considered threatening to feminists? If "choice" is what they want then every woman's right to choose should be respected and not shackled by draconian legislation disguised to be "fair".


M.C.B
said
0 0

I totally support Ms. Parent in her quest. I too, live in Quebec and would like to take my husband's and children's last name. It's time for Quebec to change their laws about this matter. There is no viable reason for the laws to be the way they are in this day and age.


Bob
said
0 0

Isn't this typical of Quebec. They have repressive, unconstitutional language laws. Maybe they were afraid too many French girls would marry anglos and the French names would disappear.

Joe
said
0 0

I don't see how feminists 25 years ago could have thought that denying women the choice was a progressive move. We live in a free society and women deffinetly need to have the right to chose to take the name of their spouse. Ridiculous is all I have to say about this law.


Nathalie A
said
0 0

This was also a problem for me, I would love to have both my husbands and childrens name. Get with the times Quebec, give women a choice

Good luck Caroline!


Marie
said
0 0

I do not think that Quebec should not revisit that law. The law was put in place to give women equal rights in mariage. Not too long ago, women would change their name when they would pass from their fathers ownership to their husbands. Woman are not property! Our ancestors fought hard to have equal rights, why would we want to go back now?


M
said
0 0

It is so much easier to keep your own last name. You don't have to change your name on all your documents and cards. With the divorce rate being so high, if you decide to separate from your husband, you have to restart the whole process and go back to your original name. It is a lot of trouble for you and for the province!


SG
said
0 0

I am not surprised that this ridiculous law has not been challenged. Every woman should have a CHOICE. That is what free societies do. Unfortunately, this is not the only law in Quebec where you DO NOT have a choice. If you are French and want to send your kids to English school, you can't. You have NO CHOICE but to send them to French school only.


Kiddo-Sue
said
0 0

I lived this in Quebec and now as a resident of Ontario it is confusing to people as to why my son's last name isn't the same as mine. Also I know of a couple who had been married 40 + years who moved to Quebec and the wife had to revert to using her maiden name!! Which according to my understanding should not have happened as ladies married prior to the change in law in 1981 were SUPPOSED to have been able to retain their married name.


Marc
said
0 0

Quebec had made that decision because there were too many divorces. In order to reduce administrative costs, the province decided that women would no longer be able to take their husband's name. I still think it should be the women's choice. If Quebec says it costs too much, then they should ask for a fee that would cover all administrative costs and in the end leave the decision to women.


Judith O'Rourke
said
0 0

I have been fighting this for 25 years - to no avail. It is insulting to women. The only time the Quebec government lets a women use her married name is on her tax return. I was married in Ontario and moved to Quebec prior to the law being enacted so my legal name is my married name. I am not allowed to use my legal name! It is my identity and very personal. Good for Caroline Parent in raising this issue. She will have a lot of support.

Michalina
said
0 0

They had the option to get married anywhere in the world other than Quebec, I can't see what all the fuss is about.....


Christopher
said
0 0

I am an anglo-Québécer who just got married in Montréal less than three months ago. How on earth was this woman SURPRISED that she couldn't change her name??? It's even in your vows when you speak the civil code of Québec - which you are supplied WELL before you get married! In addition - you're not a new person when you get married. That's the point of the ammendment in the Québec Civil Code. No one, unless they are outrageous situations, should be allowed to change their name. It is your base identity!


Robert
said
0 0

My wife and I are living this problem. She for personal reasons because of a nightmarish childhood wants to have my last name. We were flat out refused...and you know why? The QUE. GOV said that it was too much paper work because most marriages end in divorce!
What we do now is anything Canada (or work)she uses my name and anything in Quebec she uses her maiden name.
Funny though...when it comes to income tax, Quebec will call you anything you want! :)


Steve T
said
0 0

Once again, the nanny-state rears its ugly head. This is not a debate about the virtues of retaining your maiden name. This is about freedom of choice. The government has no business telling women what they should and shouldn't do.


Leah Crowe
said
0 0

It's a ridiculous law...it doesn't give women equality because it's taken away our right to choose and so now we are all stuck with our FATHERS' NAMES. If I ended up on the hospital, people I know socially may never know how to find me if they try to visit...and I want the same name as any future children I have. Our names are too long to hyphenate.


Patricia
said
0 0

My husband (last name YY) and I (last name XX)married in other country, where the bride can choose three name options after the marriage:
Mary XX (as she was before the marriage)
Mary YY (taking the husband's last name)
Mary XX YY (add the husband's last name to her name)

I chose Mary XX (remaining with my last name), because I don't believe that identity changes with the marriage. However, I think that women should have the option to change her name, if they wish as well as men, if they wish.


Me.
said
0 0

I think it's important that name changes not be taken lightly. We all have professional lives where we go by our full names. Suddenly changing names (and possibly changing back in case of divorce) may have consequences to those professional lives. A fee should be attached to the name change (at least) and men, as well as women, should be allowed to change their names on the grounds of marriage (or civil union, or whatnot); it would be the fair thing to do.


Pat Lacroix
said
0 0

As a Quebecer, it's all too common to not question silly laws and antics that we commonly say "just is". Our infrastructure is failing, our government is not economically responsible, and our education system is archaic at best. Being a "distinct society" should not allow us to become ambivalent or take away our right to question our own laws and rights and freedoms.


Gail
said
0 0

Ms. Parent seems to have missed the entire point of this issue. Why are the children required by law to take the name of their male parent? That is the issue here, not which name the mother takes.


AR
said
0 0

Good luck Caroline! I'm surprised that this issue has not been presented at the SCC as of yet. In my opinion, this is an infringement of a Canadian's legal right to life, liberity and security (Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, s.7). For Caroline to live as a dignified Canadian in her opinion, she should be able to change her last name to her husband's. However, doesn't EVERY Canadian have the right to change their name completely (first and last)? This peice of civil legislation is obsurd in my opinion. The feminist era is over. The equality era is still at large.


Brenda
said
0 0

How absurd! I had no idea there was such a law in Quebec. I assumed in Canada, as a whole, women were given the choice of which name they would go by after marriage.....so, not all things are equal in Canada....what a surprise...


Patrick Bowman
said
0 0

When the legislation was passed 25 years ago, it was to combat a bigger problem: women who wanted to keep their own name but were pressured by their family, or their husband's, to change their name to his. A quarter century later, a woman's right to keep her own name is taken so much for granted that few women would succumb to that sort of pressure any longer.


Joe E
said
0 0

I believe that the division of powers, codified when our country was established, may also play a part in this situation. The fact that each province and territory can regulate marriage law, causes a conflict of interest, for the country as a whole. Considering the time of it's enactment, could this have been an overlooked issue in the Canadian Charter?

Womens rights in Canada is still a very fresh idea, considering women weren't considered human beings in Canada until 1929. This beautiful nation has come such a long way. I wish Ms. Parenteau the best in seeking what should be rightfully hers. Choice.


FD
said
0 0

I find it absolutely baffling that anyone would want to give up their birth name, and I'm not sure I understand why keeping your own would be considered "feminist". Why would you change your identity just because you are getting married?


DFH
said
0 0

KJ wrote "Quebec insists on being so far out of touch with the rest of the world."

Actually, in much of the rest of the world, a woman's name does not necessarily change upon marriage -- China, parts of India. There are endless possible variations on this theme. I think, perhaps, KJ intended that Quebec insists on being out of touch with the "Anglo-Saxon" world, which is not a surprising fact.

I'm of the opinion that the legal surname shouldn't change, but that people (man or woman) should opt to use whatever married surname they wish socially. To do otherwise creates unnecessary costs for the state.


SERAFICO
said
0 0

20 years ago when my husband and I completed/submitted our marriage licensed forms in Toronto City Hall, on the way out I was called by the clerk and gave me a package in a brown envelope.

She said if I decide to use my husband last name, I have to fill-up the forms in the brown envelope and mail it to Ottawa.

I look at her, then I look at my fiance (now my husband) and with amazement asked, you mean I have the right to keep my last name? And she said yes.

I did not know that and at that moment I decided to keep my last name. The only thing I still remember was the excitement of the word "You Have the Right." That phrase still makes me happy.

I do not only love my husband but I really like him. We will be celebrating our 20th anniversary this year.

We were both immigrant Filipino. In our country, it was automatic and custom that you changed your last name to your husband name.Plus all the religious and cultural stuff attached to it.

I got negative remarks from his family and questioned by my so-called family here too.

But the hell with them, I love my father dearly and I have a great relationship with him. Even my father asked me why I kept my last name. So I have to explain it to him. He was in the Philippines.

I told him, it is my loyalty to you and I like my last name. And since I am a Canadian citizen now not a Filipino citizen, I've chosen my rights. And I never regret it until this day.




Geoff Ramsay (20, Ontario)
said
0 0

I support Caroline Parent, but were I alive at the time and a resident of Quebec, I would also have supported that law. Think about it, the reason it was considered 'forward-thinking' was because in that time frame there was a CLEAR and oppressive tradition of taking the husband's name along with immense social pressure to do so, I would wager many women who may have wanted to keep their own name caved to social pressure. So yes, it was forward thinking, we are lucky to live in a society and time where that social pressure is reduced and such laws seem to us an inhibitor.


Jospehine
said
0 0

Caroline wants to be able to choose what name she has. The issue is not about what name the children should take. It is about her right to choose, a right it would appear you don't think she should have because it is a traditional choice.

n reveuse
said
0 0

Wake up rest of Canada. Obviously that law needs to be revisited. How appalling that men and women in this day & age insist on being so far out of touch. Good luck trying to bring back the 1950s Ms. Parent!


AZ
said
0 0

Are you kidding me? I'm absolutely appalled that it's against the law for a woman to choose her last name when she marries. The province and goverment officials have no business in determining this. Truly insane!


BN
said
0 0

When I was married in BC (I live in Alberta) we understood that whether or not we married in BC or Alberta, etither of us would be able to choose to change our names as we saw fit. I could have taken my wife's last name if I had wanted to. I believe that element of freedom is essential.


Barb
said
0 0

A name doesn't define "who" that person is ...it only "identifies" that person. Every person who is Canadian must have the choice to be "identified" as they want. If the true issue is too much work for the government..than maybe it should be looked at as the opportunity to create new jobs within the province.
Hey, what an idea! A choice and jobs!

Good Luck Caroline


Ryan
said
0 0

There is just something about Quebec having oppressive laws when it comes to words (names, language, signs, etc...). Why doesn't Quebec get over the nonsense and let people do what they want.


JJ
said
0 0

It is truly pathetic when a woman needs to Beg the province of Quebec to change her last name. Seriously, what is the problem with Quebec, do they need TOTAL control over everyone?

CD
said
0 0

I am shocked by the opinions on both sides of this matter. If a women wants to take her husband's name - for WHATEVER reason - then she should have that choice. She is not denying feminism, nor is she giving up her identity. In fact, why can it not be considered part of your "identity" when you take on your husband's name? The name put on your birth certificate is not your identity - it's a name. An identity takes years to form and be comfortable with, and for some women, taking their husbands name is a way to add to that identity. And from what I understand feminism is about giving women the freedom of choice - not telling them what name they can or cannot have. And yes, the divorce rate may be high, but what does it say about marriage if everyone were to enter in to it thinking "Oh, I'll just keep my own name in case this doesn't work out...". I support Ms. Parent's right to decide for herself.


Gis Bun
said
0 0

Women should have the right to choose what their last name should be [actually, even men should be able to choose to change their own name as far as I'm concerned]. A name is something personal. You should be able to do what you want.


Kelly H
said
0 0

Way to go Caroline! When getting married a person should be able to decide what name they want to take. The options should be. 1) Wife takes on husband's last name. 2) Wife keeps her own. 3) Wife uses both names.
But I also believe this should work both ways. A husband should be allowed to take on his wife's last name.


Stephanie Irschick-Laviolette Ferreira
said
0 0

I was adopted in 1985 by my maternal grandmother, and she added her maiden name to mine, so I ended up with a hyphenated last name, one French-Canadian, and the other Czechoslovakian, imagine the problems that has caused! I was unaware of the law when I married and wanted to change my name to my husbands and then was told I couldn't. Most of the time the government can't even pronounce my name,or fit it all on a card (liscence, medicare ect..), certainly not on a form! We should have the choice to do what we feel is correct. I also agree that it is a nice idea to have matching names within one family, no matter whose name you decide to adopt!


GL
said
0 0

To Michalina -- Note that Caroline did not get married in Quebec -- she got married in Ontario. It doesn't matter where you get married, the law says you can't keep your name.


Dominique
said
0 0

I think that everyone should have a choice in what we want to do when it come sto this and many other issues, However, the kids could also have both names...


Laura
said
0 0

This is also going to be a problem for me. I don't understand why I am being told that I can't take my husband's name and share the same name as our future children. It just doesn't make sense. I hope Quebec revisits this law and soon.


Bliss
said
0 0

I'm shocked at how the majority of posters here seemed to have missed the point. She's not asking that the law be changed to force women to change their names, only to allow them the option to choose. Isn't the right to choice one of the key arguments feminists make? To deny a woman her choice in this matter and call it "traditional" or "a return to the 1950s" or in any way detrimental to women's rights is hypocritical.


sjg
said
0 0

A person (regardless of gender) should be able to have whatever name (first, last, middle) he or she chooses as an adult, for any reason not just marriage. If I want to change my name to "Priscilla Poopypants," I should be able to. Just wait until Ms. Parent has to get approval from Quebec to name her children!!


GLS
said
0 0

My wife and I live in and were married in Manitoba (she changed her last name by choice upon marriage). She went to Quebec for a language training course 4 years after we were married. She had to provide her maiden name to the school and all of her documentation from that program referred to her by a name that no one else had used for 4 years. She had no choice. Now THAT's ridiculous.


Deborah Holmes Bethell
said
0 0

Ms. Parent, please look beyond your nose. I was from Ontario and was angry that I could not use my married name until I realized all the legal problems if I get divorced or widowed and remarried again. That would mean that I would have had three last names that could be easily used for Identity theft. You are who you were born to be. Fight to change your name. I have one name to be proud of and I say this for legal reasons not feminist reasons. You can legally have children use your maiden name as their last names. No problem! I always sign with both my names.


MS
said
0 0

It's this total disregard for the importance of the sanctity of mariage and of the family unit that results in over 60% of children being born out of wedlock in Quebec. Quebec society needs to understand that traditional family values are not irreconcilable with human rights. On the contrary, they support and enhance them.


KM
said
0 0

I took my husband's name when I got married because I wanted to and I wanted our children to have the same last name as both of us. A friend of mine did the same thing, for the same reasons except her husband took her name. That's freedom of choice and Quebec should stop being a so insecure and give people the choice.


Paul
said
0 0

Those who don't like the laws of Québec can just get out of Québec.


JJ
said
0 0

I married in BC several years ago and moved to QC a few years ago now. I knew of the name law but did not really agree with it. I believe women should have a choice. I found it to be an honor to take on my husbands name - It is not a matter I am his property but simply my way of saying I'm yours! Name has nothing to do with it but for some, it's a privilege and those who don't agree with me, keep your maiden name. I use my married name for most purposes and my maiden name hyphened with his last name for anything legal.
I say go for it Caroline - I will follow your story and help if I ever can! It's all about choices.


Faith
said
0 0

I have a few comments about this news.

1) I can't believe we are given so much exposure to such a quest when more important matters are not even discussed. So much is happening in the world and yet we are taking time to debate on something like this.

2) If, Mrs. Parent really wants her children to have the same name. She can give them both names (Lamirande-Parent).

3) I feel a lot of women fought for us to keep our identity. I think it's a step back if we go back to the traditional way.

I really also don't see what's the fuss is about!


Todd B
said
0 0

After reading this story, several questions popped into my head. What country are we living in where a woman is not allowed to change her last name after marrying the one she loves with all her heart if she so desires to? Secondly, is this not a free country, where we have those rights? I don't seem to remember Quebec becoming it's own country, even though it tried it's hardest to. The province of Quebec is still in the nation of Canada. I understand every province within Canada has their own distinct ideas and thoughts, but we all have the rights to do what we want, when we want. That's freedom. And being in a free society, people like Mrs. Lamirande (Ms. Parent) has the right to change her last name to her husband's if she so desires to. And yes, I did refer to her in her married name, what are going to do about it? To all those who think athough wise, no one is holding a gun to your head and telling you differently.

Samantha
said
0 0

I used to feel exactly as Ms. Parent. Now I disagree. I was married in Quebec in '89 and later divorced in Quebec and have remarried again. My kids have two different last names in any case.

I had to use my maiden name in all official documents exept I was able to get my Canadian passport issued in my husband's surname and later changed it upon divorce.

Perhaps the solution is to allow name changes - regardless of marriage, sex, race, etc. through a legal means with associated fees of course. I'd hate to see any more government departments being set up in Quebec or elsewhere at taxpayers expense.

The joke is my current husband is often addressed as Mr. (surname of my first husband) when dealing with my son's teachers, etc. So, the door swings both ways.

And hey, what about gay married couples, shouldn't they too have the right to change surnames if they wish? And how about those who live together as legal spouses yet haven't undertaken a wedding for whatever reason - should they have the right to change a surname too?

The point is, we have to be realistic in what civil society can handle. I'd rather see governments focus on improved education, medical care, reducing taxes, etc. than expending efforts on name changes that will often get changed more than once!



Me.
said
0 0

Gail wrote on August 10, 2007 at 12:29:25 PM
"Ms. Parent seems to have missed the entire point of this issue. Why are the children required by law to take the name of their male parent? That is the issue here, not which name the mother takes."

Children in Quebec can have any name: father's, mother's, hyphenated, combined, whatever. The issue here is that in Quebec, if you want to change your name (whether the male or female partner) after marriage, it's a legal name change. That means that it requires paying for the name change. AFAIK, no one I know has had an issue using their partner's name socially even if their official documents do not.


Jeff S.
said
0 0

It is hard to believe that feminists would believe that this law serves the purpose of protecting a woman's right to make her own decisions without having society for them upon her. All this law has done is drive another wedge in the divide between the English and French halves of Canada. Being francophone and protecting one's culture is matter of personal choice and upbringing. If francophones truly want to remain French and unique within Canada then they should follow the lead of the newly minted Canadian societies like the Chinese and the Muslims and raise their children to respect and honour their heritage. Forcing a culture upon people through the use of laws and the creation of a distinct society within a nation has only served to alienate the people being asked for understanding and created fertile ground for discrimination and bigotry.


brem
said
0 0

Gail, kids are not bound to use the father's family name. It could be the father's, the mother's or both, hyphenated.

As for people from the "rest of Canada" saying how retarded this law is and how Quebec should wake up, Why do you care? Stay in your province and shut up!

I have married someone from out of Quebec, and she kept her last name. What's the big deal? I would have been more appaled to learn that like in BC, the default course of action is for the woman to bear the husband's name.




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